High-End Audio Designers

MylesBAstor

Well-Known Member
Apr 20, 2010
11,236
81
1,725
New York City
It is always interesting to me that in any poll of "great" audio designers, rarely are the names Lew Johnson or Bill Conrad mentioned. Names that always appear on such as list and deservedly so, are Bill Johnson, Arnie Nudell, Mark Levinson, Sid Smith, Dick Sequerra, etc.

Yet, cj is one of the "elders," including ARC, Magnepan, VPI, Linn, Quad, McIntosh, etc., of the high end industry and many of their designs have stood the test of time. The ART preamplifier, remains over twelve years later and three updates, one of the finest preamps around. The Premier 1 was a classic large wattage tube amplifier in its day (amazing sound, just soft in the upper octaves but great bass). Hmmm...what gives? Why doesn't this duo get their due?
 
Last edited:

JackD201

WBF Founding Member
Apr 20, 2010
12,308
1,425
1,820
Manila, Philippines
CJ's well earned reputation as a company validates their work. It's just always difficult to heap honors on duos. I guess it's because most folks don't really know who does what in most pairings. Are Lew and Bill like John and Paul or are they more Hall and Oates?
 

es347

VIP/Donor & WBF Founding Member
Apr 20, 2010
1,577
35
970
Midwest fly over state..
*
 
Last edited:

MylesBAstor

Well-Known Member
Apr 20, 2010
11,236
81
1,725
New York City
CJ's well earned reputation as a company validates their work. It's just always difficult to heap honors on duos. I guess it's because most folks don't really know who does what in most pairings. Are Lew and Bill like John and Paul or are they more Hall and Oates?

I've taken some time to ponder your response Jack. And it's awfully hard to come up with too many companies where two people collaborated on design. One that comes to mind is Ron Sutherland and Gayle Sanders in designing the early Martin Logan speakers. Another is Arnie Nudell and Bascom King in designing the early Infinity speakers. I'm sure there are others but can't come with them. Anybody care to chime in?

And yes, it's probably like two players on the same team splitting the votes for the league MVP :)
 

mep

Member Sponsor & WBF Founding Member
Apr 20, 2010
9,481
17
0
Please someone correct me if I am wrong here (and I am positive someone will), but maybe the reason no one names Lew Johnson and Bill Conrad as great designers is because they are not electrical engineers, they are accountants who happen to own an audio company that made some good products. The pair of them may have never designed a damn thing together. I am sure they had input on the looks of the products and input on the final sound by giving a thumbs up or a thumbs down to the person who actually designed the circuits for them. But somehow I doubt that either of them has the background and training required to design a circuit for any audio component. So, if someone knows that Lew and Bill can really sit down at a table together and draw a schematic for any of their products, do tell. And before anyone gets their feathers ruffled, I don't mean this as a knock to Lew Johnson or Bill Conrad. There are plenty of successful people who own companies that build products that they couldn't personally engineer. You have the vision and hire the talent. And you make sure the talent builds what you like and want you want to sell. And I think that describes Conrad Johnson. And if I am right, that would explain why no one has nominated them as great designers. By contrast, William Zane Johnson actually designed many of that company's products over the years. That man understands electronics and knows how to draw a schematic.

Mark
 

MylesBAstor

Well-Known Member
Apr 20, 2010
11,236
81
1,725
New York City
Please someone correct me if I am wrong here (and I am positive someone will), but maybe the reason no one names Lew Johnson and Bill Conrad as great designers is because they are not electrical engineers, they are accountants who happen to own an audio company that made some good products. The pair of them may have never designed a damn thing together. I am sure they had input on the looks of the products and input on the final sound by giving a thumbs up or a thumbs down to the person who actually designed the circuits for them. But somehow I doubt that either of them has the background and training required to design a circuit for any audio component. So, if someone knows that Lew and Bill can really sit down at a table together and draw a schematic for any of their products, do tell. And before anyone gets their feathers ruffled, I don't mean this as a knock to Lew Johnson or Bill Conrad. There are plenty of successful people who own companies that build products that they couldn't personally engineer. You have the vision and hire the talent. And you make sure the talent builds what you like and want you want to sell. And I think that describes Conrad Johnson. And if I am right, that would explain why no one has nominated them as great designers. By contrast, William Zane Johnson actually designed many of that company's products over the years. That man understands electronics and knows how to draw a schematic.

Mark

Well knowing the duo, I'd have to totally disagre with you (and I know Bill Johnson also and respect his contributions too). Lew and Bill are two brilliant people who decided on economics/math as a career but have always been involved in electronics. You know that many high end designers started out in other careers. Harry Weisfeld started in AC and sheet metal work. Alan Perkins started out in another totally different field and is arguably one of the best tt designers out there. His latest deck really has impressed me. You know what I find schooling does: it should teach you how to research and learn an area. And we can argue that there are only so many tube circuit designs out there and everything is derived from them. Kinda like the embellishment that goes on in folk music.

And I think that the way that many high-end audio designers work nowadays is that they come up with the concept of how they want the circuit to look--and then give it to other people to implement their ideas. That's true at ARC, Krell and most other high end companies. (And actually you should see the collection of rebuilt Victrolas in Lew Johnson's basement :) ).
 

mep

Member Sponsor & WBF Founding Member
Apr 20, 2010
9,481
17
0
So Myles-are you saying that both Conrad and Johnson have actually designed their own circuits? Being "involved" with electronics is much different than possessing the knowledge and ability to understand how circuits work and have the ability to sit down with pen and paper and actually design a circuit and draw the schematic for what you have conceived. If you know this to be true, then hats off to the team of Conrad and Johnson. You can't come up with a concept of how you want the circuit to look if you don't understand circuit design. You can come up with a concept of a product for a certain market segment, what tubes you want it to use, what it is going to look like, and what it will sell for (oh, let's say you want to have a $2K tube amp that uses EL-34s), and you don't have to have any knowledge of electronics to do that. I am trying to draw the distinction between developing a concept for a product vice actually engineering the product.

Mark
 

MylesBAstor

Well-Known Member
Apr 20, 2010
11,236
81
1,725
New York City
So Myles-are you saying that both Conrad and Johnson have actually designed their own circuits? Being "involved" with electronics is much different than possessing the knowledge and ability to understand how circuits work and have the ability to sit down with pen and paper and actually design a circuit and draw the schematic for what you have conceived. If you know this to be true, then hats off to the team of Conrad and Johnson. You can't come up with a concept of how you want the circuit to look if you don't understand circuit design. You can come up with a concept of a product for a certain market segment, what tubes you want it to use, what it is going to look like, and what it will sell for (oh, let's say you want to have a $2K tube amp that uses EL-34s), and you don't have to have any knowledge of electronics to do that. I am trying to draw the distinction between developing a concept for a product vice actually engineering the product.

Mark

Yes. And early on starting using CAD to lay out the circuit boards.
 

mep

Member Sponsor & WBF Founding Member
Apr 20, 2010
9,481
17
0
OK-hats off to Conrad and Johnson. Back to your original question-why hasn't someone nominated the dynamic duo for being outstanding designers? I don't know, but I really don't care either. I still haven't gotten over that Counterpoint thing.

Mark
 

jadis

Well-Known Member
Apr 28, 2010
12,352
5,470
2,810
Manila, Philippines
It is always interesting to me that in any poll of "great" audio designers, rarely are the names Lew Johnson or Bill Conrad mentioned. Names that always appear on such as list and deservedly so, are Bill Johnson, Arnie Nudell, Mark Levinson, Sid Smith, Dick Sequerra, etc.

Yet, cj is one of the "elders," including ARC, Magnepan, VPI, Linn, Quad, McIntosh, etc., of the high end industry and many of their designs have stood the test of time. The ART preamplifier, remains over twelve years later and three updates, one of the finest preamps around. The Premier 1 was a classic large wattage tube amplifier in its day (amazing sound, just soft in the upper octaves but great bass). Hmmm...what gives? Why doesn't this duo get their due?

Good point, Myles. I wonder why the tandem is seldom mentioned too. Yes, my old friends talk highly of CJ's Premeire 1. I had used the MV125 in the early 90s and was very happy with it. It pushed the 'lushness' quality of female vocals to another level which was almost intoxicating. I think they call it the CJ 'caramel flavor'. So much so that when I moved to the Jadis JA200, initially I was disappointed because that caramel mid disappeared. And boy, did my CJ have great bass, my friends call it the 'sledgehammer bass'. I played a lot of Telarcs then when I had this amp.
 
Last edited:

MylesBAstor

Well-Known Member
Apr 20, 2010
11,236
81
1,725
New York City
Good point, Myles. I wonder why the tandem is seldom mentioned too. Yes, my old friends talk highly of CJ's Premeire 1. I had used the MV125 in the early 90s and was very happy with it. It pushed the 'lushness' quality of female vocals to another level which was almost intoxicating. I think they call it the CJ 'caramel flavor'. So much so that when I moved to the Jadis JA200, initially I was disappointed because that caramel mid disappeared. And boy, did my CJ have great bass, my friends call it the 'sledgehammer bass'. I played a lot of Telarcs then when I had this amp.

Yep had the 125 too, representative of the older, more colored but thoroughly beguiling tube sound.

I had a close friend go from the Premier 5s to the Jadis JA-80s. The Jadis was less colored and more resolving but just didn't have the power to drive his Infinity RS1-bs (albeit just from about 120 Hz and up).

Another friend had the JA-500s on his MBL101a's and that was a nice combo though it always had an edge. As Ralph Karsten pointed out, the speakers impedance curve probably had something to do with the edge.
 

Gregadd

WBF Founding Member
Apr 20, 2010
10,517
1,774
1,850
Metro DC
Since my first true high-end product was the the cj pv5 I think I should comment. The PV5 was a wonderfully euphoniclaly colored device. As the story has it. Lew and Bill were government economist living in Metro DC. Legend has it that they walked into the now defunct Audio Associates in Arlington, Viriginia with thier first tube pre-amp. Proving that luck is in fact being prepared for an oppurtunity.,Bill Johnson of Audio Research decided to go solid state. HP of the absolute sound refused to go with him and subsequently annointed conrad-johnson. The rest is history. Were it not for my pursuit of the pv5, I might never have discovered the ML/CLS. Double thanks.
 

C.A.P

Well-Known Member
Apr 23, 2010
139
17
363
As much as he is not taken seriously. Robert Carver, He has designed some remarkable things and made good audio reachable to the masses. I have had both Carver gear and Sunfire and the Sunfire is a damn good design. Stone cold into any load. its clean and powerful. The Silver seven was one of the best tube designs in the 90.

Dan D,Agostino is another. His Class A amplification and sustained plateau Biasing is great. As well as the CAST design and the MRS Amps. The KPS25SC all in one CD player pre amp is a world class design.

Of course Gayle Sanders and Ron Sutherland. Jim Whinney of Magnapan.
 

caesar

Well-Known Member
May 30, 2010
4,290
767
1,698
I like Conrad Johnson a lot. I have their top of the line stuff in one of my systems. However, speaking to industry insiders, they do not get the respect of say - Audio research, because they are associated with the "golden glow", a coloration. I like the brand a lot, though, especially the stuff made in the last 6 years which is more neutral sounding.
 

MylesBAstor

Well-Known Member
Apr 20, 2010
11,236
81
1,725
New York City
I like Conrad Johnson a lot. I have their top of the line stuff in one of my systems. However, speaking to industry insiders, they do not get the respect of say - Audio research, because they are associated with the "golden glow", a coloration. I like the brand a lot, though, especially the stuff made in the last 6 years which is more neutral sounding.

Interesting take. Why would their "golden glow" be any more of a coloration than "high definition."

I find what makes high-end audio actually is the designers handprint on the design of the equipment. In the end, every piece of equipment represents what the designer feels real music sounds like. Some gear is denoted by their dynamics; others soundstaging; others tonality, etc.
 

Wardsweb

Well-Known Member
May 8, 2010
411
62
935
66
San Antonio, TX
wardswebllc.com
I'll toss James Bongiorno's hat (the red one LOL) in the ring. I found out about James back when I was collecting SAE equipment. Here are just a few of his designs:

Dynaco: Stereo 400 power amplifier
SAE: XXXIB, IIIC/CM, IVD/DM power amplifier
GAS: Ampzilla power amplifier, Thaedra preamplifier
SUMO: The Power power amplifier, The Gold power amplifier, “Charlie” the Tuner
Spread Spectrum Technologies: Ampzilla 2000 power amplifier, Ambrosia preamplifier
 

es347

VIP/Donor & WBF Founding Member
Apr 20, 2010
1,577
35
970
Midwest fly over state..
How about David Hafler.
 

MylesBAstor

Well-Known Member
Apr 20, 2010
11,236
81
1,725
New York City
I guess this thread started out about Lew Johnson and Bill Conrad but perhaps it might be more interesting if we start a new thread about who are/were leading high-end designers and made significant contributions to the industry.
 

caesar

Well-Known Member
May 30, 2010
4,290
767
1,698
Interesting take. Why would their "golden glow" be any more of a coloration than "high definition."

I find what makes high-end audio actually is the designers handprint on the design of the equipment. In the end, every piece of equipment represents what the designer feels real music sounds like. Some gear is denoted by their dynamics; others soundstaging; others tonality, etc.

I agree with you. However, ARC has a couple of very influential reviewers on their side. Jonathan Valin praises their products profusely in every review in the Absolute Sound. Here's a quote from Valin:

"...First there is Audio Research’s tonal palette. If, in life and in audio, tone colors must perforce be projected against a tinted backdrop, I’ll take ARC’s offwhite canvas over the raven blackness of much solid-state, the toast-brown of certain other tube gear, and the chalk of certain examples of each topology (such as Spectral and middle-vintage ARC). To my ear, this “neutral” background interferes less with the purity of timbres— doesn’t skew them as much toward the darkness of bass or the brightness of treble. As a result, tonal balance in the Reference gear is sensationally “right.” ....


On the other side of the Atlantic, ARC has strong support from Ken Kessler. In a recent review of their class D integrated, Kessler compared the amp to a $15,000 bottle of wine. Needless to say, both of these guys have ARC as part of their reference system.
 

About us

  • What’s Best Forum is THE forum for high end audio, product reviews, advice and sharing experiences on the best of everything else. This is THE place where audiophiles and audio companies discuss vintage, contemporary and new audio products, music servers, music streamers, computer audio, digital-to-analog converters, turntables, phono stages, cartridges, reel-to-reel tape machines, speakers, headphones and tube and solid-state amplification. Founded in 2010 What’s Best Forum invites intelligent and courteous people of all interests and backgrounds to describe and discuss the best of everything. From beginners to life-long hobbyists to industry professionals, we enjoy learning about new things and meeting new people, and participating in spirited debates.

Quick Navigation

User Menu

Steve Williams
Site Founder | Site Owner | Administrator
Ron Resnick
Site Co-Owner | Administrator
Julian (The Fixer)
Website Build | Marketing Managersing