PYT Audio, and other panels

bonzo75

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I have demoed SMT and am a fan, most of my experiences in Flyer's room, Elberoth's and Jazzhead's have been documented on Flyer's thread.

Yesterday I was at Joel's place, and his room is a square 7m * 7m, with a sloping roof that reflects a lot from one slope to the other.

However, I could hear no room problems because with the help of an acoustician Joel has tamed the room RT to 0.3sec, for his Vivd Giya G1, which are tough to set up.

But what impressed me was that he has done it using material that blends into the decor and does not intrude into the room. He has been through GIK, vicoustic and other panels. He has now settled on PYT audio and another German brand (he can provide details) for absorption. He has two DAADs in either corner, which are the only intrusive elements in the entire room (apart from the G1s, of course!)

What you see below are the German panels used as absorbers. These have been put up parallel to the ceilings, are thin perforated panels, with space between them, and can be colored or painted/imprinted on to suit the room decor.

On the last pic, I have shown the gap between the panel and the ceiling so that one can differentiate, but if you were in the room in person, you just would not notice these panels unless you looked at that gap.

Best left to Joel to explain the technical details
 

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bonzo75

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bonzo75

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Again, next to the wooden beam, if you look for the small two black corners, you will be able to see the panels
 

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FrantzM

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Impressive!
As invisible as anything can be ...
 

bonzo75

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Did you also manage to hear the LeedH speakers?
Keith.

Yes they are very good. Not as good as the vivid but for the size I think they are the best speakers for small rooms (can go near a wall), are small enough to not be intrusive. They are 83 db sensitivity and not sure ypsilon was the best match. I think they will also be good MCH speakers, as a third one identical to left and right can probably be placed in the room easily.

They have a very open sound like panel speakers
 

Joel

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Hi Ked,

As I explained you, my approach to room treatment has been guided by prior measurements, virtualization of my room's acoustics through dedicated IT tools, and application of soft treatments to achieve a semi-reverberant listening environment.
Then, solutions have resulted from technical studies and strict aesthetics coaching of my wife... :)

The large translucent panels are micro perforated films and act as follows :
When the acoustic energy or sound wave goes through the perforations, it is transformed into heat through friction, significantly reducing reverberation time and sound level.
The efficiency of Microsorber films can be reinforced using two layers separated by 3 cm (that's my personal case).
They can be printed to blend flawlessly in whatever environment. It's also a kind of "industrial solution" and most customers are public offices, conference centers, and sometimes audiophile installations...
An example of what has been achieved in the main conference room of the French central bank :

http://microsorber.net/uk/references/films/banque-de-france-auditorium/

Cheers,

Joel
 

christoph

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Hello Kedar and Joel

Thank you for this interesting thread.

I haven't found any prices on the microsorber web page.
Can you give me an approximate price point for the clear microsorber film per m2?

Cheers,
Christoph
 

flyer

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It does seem to effectively to blend in well with the room. I wouldn't go that far to say that the treatment is not protruding though, it is a matter of having matching colors with the walls and the ceiling. And yes, the eyes want to be treated in the same way as the ears. If we don't think about that, for sure someone else will for us ;)

I already heard good things about the microsorber. Seems to be really useful especially if one has a saddle shaped ceiling. I have seen it with very nice lighting behind which makes it all the more spectacular.

On the PYT panels I have some reservations but hey, if it sounds OK in that room (for now), all the better.
 

audioblazer

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Hello Kedar and Joel

Thank you for this interesting thread.

I haven't found any prices on the microsorber web page.
Can you give me an approximate price point for the clear microsorber film per m2?

Cheers,
Christoph


Euro90/m2

image.jpg
 

Joel

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For price information, 90 € is for film only.
You should forecast circa € 150 for whole set (fixing shafts and brackets + laying included).
Application is rather tricky as the film tension between the brackets calls for ultra precise measurements.
DIY could then be more expensive taking into account the lost sheets, compared to the application made by a professional.
 

christoph

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Hello Audioblazer and Joel

Thank you for the prices.
Is the film also usable for panels in front of windows (with the needed distance)?
 

bonzo75

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For that you can also dry diffusers like SMT. 1 behind each speaker, 1 behind and in the centre, 1 at first reflection point of each speaker. But it is 2 feet deep, though transparent.
 

Joel

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Yes it works extremely well on glass surfaces.
You need to keep the same distance from the window than for a wall : 7 cm at least.
The French distributor has installed one layer of microsorber directly on the glass door of his shop. The left side was treated and the right side not. When you stand talking in front of each side of this glass door, the difference is impressive...
 

flyer

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For that you can also dry diffusers like SMT. 1 behind each speaker, 1 behind and in the centre, 1 at first reflection point of each speaker. But it is 2 feet deep, though transparent.

Hi, allow me a small correction. The SMT wings are only 18 cms/7 inches deep. They are 60 cms or two feet wide though...
Soon there will also be a transparent S-wing of only 9 cms deep, i.e. half that depth.

Just an added info: the microsorber is an absorber whereas the SMT wings are diffusers that also do scattering and temporal diffusion which greatly reduces flutter echo at listening position (amongst a few other things but don't want to spoil this thread).
 
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bonzo75

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Yes it works extremely well on glass surfaces.
You need to keep the same distance from the window than for a wall : 7 cm at least.
The French distributor has installed one layer of microsorber directly on the glass door of his shop. The left side was treated and the right side not. When you stand talking in front of each side of this glass door, the difference is impressive...

But then they will have to be stuck on the glass, right? Christoph probably doesn't want to do that. He has a nice view behind his speakers, so he he needs something that he can move into place while listening and then take it out, is my guess. Reason I also recommended SMT is that it has wheels.
 

Joel

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I didn't understand what you mean.
They have to be fixed on the window's chassis to get the minimum space between glass and film.
For a window of course, you have to point on transparent Microsorber film, and not translucent as used in my room...
 

bonzo75

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Oh, so do you get the Microsorber transparent as well?

Christoph has a beautiful view behind his speakers that looks on to the mountains. He will want something so that the sound is not reflected off the glass yet it does not block the view - so a transparent microsorber or a movable SMT, depending on whether he wants absorption or diffusion

I would like one of those solutions behind a panel for future consideration - will make my house search much easier
 

Joel

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Yes, they can be ordered transparent or translucent.
Transparent film is obviously better for glass and windows. Translucent ones are better for common walls and can be printed on demand if needed.

In relation to panels, I have no precise opinion as the rear firing design requires a certain interaction with the wall... it's more a minimum space available - positionning issue in my opinion, but why not ?
 

audioblazer

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For that you can also dry diffusers like SMT. 1 behind each speaker, 1 behind and in the centre, 1 at first reflection point of each speaker. But it is 2 feet deep, though transparent.

I did similar helmholtz resonators . I have 16 of it & probably need more. Take up a lot of space but it works to certain extent
 

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