Chinese DAC shames a few heavy hitters

Blizzard

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Sep 30, 2015
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Why don´t you focus on products and forget about the owners? As far as I know this is an audio forum, not a therapy group!

I was just explaining why we shouldn't expect much interest here. I have said quite a bit about the product.
 

Blizzard

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Lee

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Feb 3, 2011
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The problem with most Sabre chip designs are weak output stages. Not the case with this DAC. The Sabre brightness, some people talk about isn't even from the chip, it's from undersized ic opamp based output stages. The 9018 chip is a 8 channel DAC, and the output stage must sink a lot of current when the channels are paralleled. When built undersized, you run into an edgy sound. Proper engineering overcomes this.

I totally agree...to a point. I have the LH Labs Pulse X Infinity which is based on the Sabre AQ2M chip which sounds terrific. I think all DACs involve three primary design steps which are complex: usb input, chip/software for FPGA, and analog output stage.

However, the FPGA designs seem to have an edge based on extensive listening to the PS Audio DirectStream and Chord Hugo. There seems to be more detail and smoothness all at once.
 

Johnny Vinyl

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May 16, 2010
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No more personal comments please. This is a very interesting product and discussions should be limited to that.
I hope we see more of these "affordable" pricepoint products and threads created for them. I hope that wasn't too personal of a comment though. ;)
 
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Blizzard

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how about the guys in the know put together a chinese made system or debate such things as you are. this will be great for the people reading this that want great sounds but are concerned about price and value...

we have a dac by the sounds of it... transport pre and amp?

good advice for a second system too. i am very intrested so thanks blizzard and co for helping shed light on these far away gems.

The thing is they may be far away, but you place the order and the service is second to none. Very nice folks over at shenzhenaudio
as well. Not just good value. Fast shipping too. I really think the product and the service are what counts the most.
 

nc42acc

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Nov 10, 2015
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This is what I hear with the X20 compared to the Vega and Yggydrasil, both great DACs in their own market share. I would like someone with a DAC in the SOTA category to hear the X20. I am just saying the X20 has changed my listening habits in terms of analog or digital. And I really like Chinese food too, maybe just Asian since I can include Thai. Chill out guys this is suppose to be fun.

I totally agree...to a point. I have the LH Labs Pulse X Infinity which is based on the Sabre AQ2M chip which sounds terrific. I think all DACs involve three primary design steps which are complex: usb input, chip/software for FPGA, and analog output stage.

However, the FPGA designs seem to have an edge based on extensive listening to the PS Audio DirectStream and Chord Hugo. There seems to be more detail and smoothness all at once.
 

nc42acc

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Nov 10, 2015
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Are you asking about the remainder of my system?

how about the guys in the know put together a chinese made system or debate such things as you are. this will be great for the people reading this that want great sounds but are concerned about price and value...

we have a dac by the sounds of it... transport pre and amp?

good advice for a second system too. i am very intrested so thanks blizzard and co for helping shed light on these far away gems.
 

nc42acc

Member Sponsor
Nov 10, 2015
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Aurender N10 > Kimber Ag USB > Gustard X20 > Luminous Audio Silver Reference XLR > BAT VK50SE > ZenWave D3 XLR > Rogue Audio ST100 > Bren1 Oasis > Von Schweikert VR5 Anniversary MKII mids and upper. Wireworld Silver Eclipse 7 XLR > Parasound A21 > Bren1 Oasis > Von Schweikert VR5 Anniversary MKII bass

I think that is my complete digital chain.

The Gustard and the VR5 are the two mainstays. I reserve the right to change everything else at my discretion.
 
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Blizzard

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Sep 30, 2015
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Ok guys. I'm out of this conversation. I'll be in my rubber room if anyone want to chat.
 

FrantzM

Member Sponsor & WBF Founding Member
Apr 20, 2010
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Great New Year resolution ... You are a happy man to have only a closet, I have a filled garage to empty!;)

Care for a listing of things you want to part with via PM? Some might find a new home under the Tropics... ;)

Happy New Year micro!
 

Rodney Gold

Member
Jan 29, 2014
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Nothing wrong with cheaper stuff..I use a $299 sqeezebox touch as my front end and a $899 miniDSP dirac box (from fong kong)behind that.
 

nc42acc

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Nov 10, 2015
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Mike you have your place here in the forum just like the rest of us. I also feel you have a wealth of information to share in your areas of expertise. Sit back and listen to some of these other guys and learn. Nobody knows everything. And please my friend PLEASE try some decaf coffee.


Ok guys. I'm out of this conversation. I'll be in my rubber room if anyone want to chat.
 

amirm

Banned
Apr 2, 2010
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Any objection to moving this thread to Mike's forum since he has shared so much insight on its make up?
 

amirm

Banned
Apr 2, 2010
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Vast majority of our members arrive at threads by using "New Posts." So no matter where the thread is, it gets read. I am certainly here and will be reporting on this DAC post CES.

Alternatively we could move Mike's forum under the Digital/DAC main forum instead of member area.
 

wisnon

Well-Known Member
Dec 12, 2011
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He designs digital to analog chips for a living. Half of his patents are for analog circuits. Do you really think he can't design an output stage? That's like kindergarten level compared to what he usually does. I'm really not sure why anyone should think that this output stage is anything short of SOTA. Combined with Hqplayer, I wouldn't doubt it if it could out do the Lampi GG :) certainly better clocks and measurements.

Anyways I have no concrete proof of who designed this output stage, but it looks like a real nice design to me.
Your words not mine.

I have actually heard several Dacs of all price ranges and nothing so far has displaced the GG as my favorite, not worried in the least about that. Lukasz is damn good in analog…you should hear his amps.

You said this guy is a DIGITAL expert and we speak of analog output and no, digital expert does not necessarily translate to analog oputput stage expert…. that much should be clear. Of course, its also possible that he is.
 

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