SAT carbon fibre tone arm from Sweden

spiritofmusic

Well-Known Member
Jun 13, 2013
14,605
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E. England
Mike, audiophiles are always living in hope.
Hoping the next upgrade is THE upgrade.
Hoping a premium scarcity value tonearm might just come up at a great price.
 

TrackingAngle

Industry Expert
Mar 4, 2014
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Much of the upgrade is logistical (ships more securely, more easily replaced wiring harness) though he claims an incremental sonic upgrade as well.
 

XV-1

Well-Known Member
May 24, 2010
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Sydney

spiritofmusic

Well-Known Member
Jun 13, 2013
14,605
5,413
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E. England
You just GOTTA love the phrase "more affordable" in relation to a 25k arm.

I'd love to say LOL, but I really can't.
 

PeterA

Well-Known Member
Dec 6, 2011
12,522
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SAT (Swedish Analog Technologies) Begins Delivering Four New Pickup Arms

Show me the money!!

LM-09 : 25.400 USD
LM-12 : 29.000 USD
CF1-09 : 48.000 USD
CF1-12 : 53.000 USD

I wonder if Mikey is getting the 9 and 12 inch 50k arms :)

https://www.analogplanet.com/content/sat-swedish-analog-technologies-begins-delivering-four-new-pickup-arms-0

That is an interesting link in which Marc Gomez is quoted as saying that the different length arms sound different. He developed the longer version because customers asked for it. Some prefer the sound of a longer arm, some simply need a longer arm to fit on their tables. It will be interesting to see if M. Fremer actually does a direct comparison between the same arm of two different lengths. Given that he already has the original arm, with four new arms to choose from, I would like to see a direct comparison between his original and the CF1-09, and then one between the CF1-09 and CF1-12. I can not imagine he would now prefer the longer length given his past statements, but it would be interesting to read how he describes the sonic differences he hears between the two different lengths.

Also interesting is the way the armtube is made by building up very thin layers of carbon fiber and then once cured, milling it into the tapered shape resulting in some funky and unique finishes. Perhaps a very long tube is made and then cut up into the 9" and 12" lengths, rather than building up the armtubes individually. That might account for some of the supposed reduction in manufacturing costs.

If these do give higher performance than the original design, I give Mr. Gomez credit for continuing to want to push the envelope to create an even better sounding arm. It's just too bad it costs so much. I think the Durand is in about the same price range as the LM models. Has anyone done a direct comparison between an SAT and Durand arm? I would also like to know what the effective masses of the various SAT arms are.
 

Tango

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I will be thanking Mr. Fremer if he test the new TOL model and say yeah it is a little better than the old one.
 

DaveyF

Well-Known Member
Jul 31, 2010
6,129
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La Jolla, Calif USA
SAT (Swedish Analog Technologies) Begins Delivering Four New Pickup Arms

Show me the money!!

LM-09 : 25.400 USD
LM-12 : 29.000 USD
CF1-09 : 48.000 USD
CF1-12 : 53.000 USD

I wonder if Mikey is getting the 9 and 12 inch 50k arms :)

https://www.analogplanet.com/content/sat-swedish-analog-technologies-begins-delivering-four-new-pickup-arms-0


WOW!!!

One of these days, I would love to hear how these guys come up with these specific prices...
$53K for a tonearm, not made from solid 24K gold or maybe solid platinum and encrusted with diamonds, seems to me to be an interesting price point. Why $53K...and not say...$300K or more. Where does $53K come from??
The actual cost to produce this arm surely cannot be anywhere near that price...so what is the markup that Gomez is interested in? ( maybe not our business, but he is like so many manufacturer's these days, that are prevalent in our hobby)
One of my fellow a'phile friends is telling me that 800% markups are very common now in the cable area of the industry.

Yes, I have my flame suit on, so lets hear it from those folks who think this situation is not only par for the course, but perfectly acceptable to them.:rolleyes::eek:

Luckily, we all still have the opportunity to vote with our wallet when it comes to something like this.
 

Al M.

VIP/Donor
Sep 10, 2013
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WOW!!!

One of these days, I would love to hear how these guys come up with these specific prices...
$53K for a tonearm, not made from solid 24K gold or maybe solid platinum and encrusted with diamonds, seems to me to be an interesting price point. Why $53K...and not say...$300K or more. Where does $53K come from??
The actual cost to produce this arm surely cannot be anywhere near that price...so what is the markup that Gomez is interested in? ( maybe not our business, but he is like so many manufacturer's these days, that are prevalent in our hobby)
One of my fellow a'phile friends is telling me that 800% markups are very common now in the cable area of the industry.

Yes, I have my flame suit on, so lets hear it from those folks who think this situation is not only par for the course, but perfectly acceptable to them.:rolleyes::eek:

Luckily, we all still have the opportunity to vote with our wallet when it comes to something like this.

They sure look ugly with those different patterns. Well worth the price...
 

DaveyF

Well-Known Member
Jul 31, 2010
6,129
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La Jolla, Calif USA
They sure look ugly with those different patterns. Well worth the price...

LOL.:D

You have only paid thousands of $$'s for those patterns, so you had better like them...:D

I noticed some interesting and IMO, on-point responses, on MF's forum to the new SAT arm article. I am still curious to see if anyone can actually produce a high end product at a price that MF would have the balls to come out and say..."hey, this thing is priced so stupidly that it is truly an insult to one's intelligence!!". I suspect I will have to wait forever, given his history. :(
 

Al M.

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Sep 10, 2013
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LOL.:D

You have only paid thousands of $$'s for those patterns, so you had better like them...:D

And even if YOU like your specific patterns, how do you re-sell? The buyer needs to like them too...Oh, the subtle complications of life. ;)

I noticed some interesting and IMO, on-point responses, on MF's forum to the new SAT arm article. I am still curious to see if anyone can actually produce a high end product at a price that MF would have the balls to come out and say..."hey, this thing is priced so stupidly that it is truly an insult to one's intelligence!!". I suspect I will have to wait forever, given his history. :(

Yes, nothing is too crazy in the high-end these days. But they'll incrementally keep raising the prices and people will continue to be fooled and find 'justifications'. Just like the fable of the frog in the water where the temperature is raised slowly so the frog doesn't perceive the danger until it is cooked to death.

If you had told people 30 years ago how crazy prices get they would have said, "you are insane, no way! You are not conning me!" To stay with the fable, the frog would have jumped out of the hot water, when suddenly thrown in.
 

KeithR

VIP/Donor
May 7, 2010
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WOW!!!

One of these days, I would love to hear how these guys come up with these specific prices...
$53K for a tonearm, not made from solid 24K gold or maybe solid platinum and encrusted with diamonds, seems to me to be an interesting price point. Why $53K...and not say...$300K or more. Where does $53K come from??
The actual cost to produce this arm surely cannot be anywhere near that price...so what is the markup that Gomez is interested in? ( maybe not our business, but he is like so many manufacturer's these days, that are prevalent in our hobby)
One of my fellow a'phile friends is telling me that 800% markups are very common now in the cable area of the industry.

Yes, I have my flame suit on, so lets hear it from those folks who think this situation is not only par for the course, but perfectly acceptable to them.:rolleyes::eek:

Luckily, we all still have the opportunity to vote with our wallet when it comes to something like this.

Don't forget the 20k cartridge to go with!
 

Al M.

VIP/Donor
Sep 10, 2013
8,684
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DaveyF

Well-Known Member
Jul 31, 2010
6,129
181
458
La Jolla, Calif USA
And even if YOU like your specific patterns, how do you re-sell? The buyer needs to like them too...Oh, the subtle complications of life. ;)



Yes, nothing is too crazy in the high-end these days. But they'll incrementally keep raising the prices and people will continue to be fooled and find 'justifications'. Just like the fable of the frog in the water where the temperature is raised slowly so the frog doesn't perceive the danger until it is cooked to death.

If you had told people 30 years ago how crazy prices get they would have said, "you are insane, no way! You are not conning me!" To stay with the fable, the frog would have jumped out of the hot water, when suddenly thrown in.


Best post I have read all day....+10000
 

rockitman

Member Sponsor
Sep 20, 2011
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I guess I will be the first one here to proclaim the absolute ridiculousness of the now $50,000 tonearm. Quite frankly I found $30,000 ridiculous ! (LOL)
 

microstrip

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May 30, 2010
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I guess I will be the first one here to proclaim the absolute ridiculousness of the now $50,000 tonearm. Quite frankly I found $30,000 ridiculous ! (LOL)

FIY, scientists know that the fable of the frog is not true, unless you listen to cylinders using an Edison phonograph. Contemporary audiophiles will react if the price is too high! :D

I will quote Wikipedia text, the subject does not deserve my typing time. "While some 19th-century experiments suggested that the underlying premise is true if the heating is sufficiently gradual,[1][2] according to contemporary biologists the premise is false: a frog that is gradually heated will jump out.[3][4] Indeed, thermoregulation by changing location is a fundamentally necessary survival strategy for frogs and other ectotherms. "
 

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