Why are audiophiles so sensitive?

caesar · Aug 25, 2015

So many folks get bent out of shape when a piece of gear they own or like gets criticized. And with different realism triggers, it's only natural that people will appreciate different aspects of sound based on a designer's engineering choices. Yet it seems to me that many audiophiles would rather have their actual human child called ugly rather than a component of system that they bought.

And just a few months later, they turn around and swap a piece of gear after reading something on a forum or reading a professional review that calls their piece of gear ugly (which is the primary job of the reviewer, who is incentivized to get advertising into their publication and to get the manufacturer to "move their product" based on the review, and also incentivized to please the manufacturer to get into his house the toys that he likes).

Why is it so hard for many to accept that this is just a hobby with a variety of tastes and goals?

BlueFox · Aug 25, 2015

caesar said:
So many folks get bent out of shape when a piece of gear they own or like gets criticized. And with different realism triggers, it's only natural that people will appreciate different aspects of sound based on a designer's engineering choices. Yet it seems to me that many audiophiles would rather have their actual human child called ugly rather than a component of system that they bought.

And just a few months later, they turn around and swap a piece of gear after reading something on a forum or reading a professional review that calls their piece of gear ugly (which is the primary job of the reviewer, who is incentivized to get advertising into their publication and to get the manufacturer to "move their product" based on the review, and also incentivized to please the manufacturer to get into his house the toys that he likes).

Why is it so hard for many to accept that this is just a hobby with a variety of tastes and goals?

Now we read reviewers are paid to write bad reviews, while recently it was reviewers never write bad reviews. Go figure.

Audiophile Bill · Aug 25, 2015

caesar said:
So many folks get bent out of shape when a piece of gear they own or like gets criticized. And with different realism triggers, it's only natural that people will appreciate different aspects of sound based on a designer's engineering choices. Yet it seems to me that many audiophiles would rather have their actual human child called ugly rather than a component of system that they bought.

And just a few months later, they turn around and swap a piece of gear after reading something on a forum or reading a professional review that calls their piece of gear ugly (which is the primary job of the reviewer, who is incentivized to get advertising into their publication and to get the manufacturer to "move their product" based on the review, and also incentivized to please the manufacturer to get into his house the toys that he likes).

Why is it so hard for many to accept that this is just a hobby with a variety of tastes and goals?

I think you bring up an interesting observation that unfortunately ultimately requires a thorough examination of human psychology. However, as a casual observer of this phenomenon, it strikes me that it is not the act of contrasting views per se, rather the *manner* by which the exchange occurs. Specifically the normal social manners that people tend to abide by in face to face interactions goes out of the window and in comes quasi-psychopathic tendencies. The best analogy I can give is the atrocious behaviour that some drivers have whilst behind their armoured shell - gesticulations and foul language are common exchanges from behind the wheel - these same individuals just don't behave the same way when on foot / in person in public places.

So in sum, it is a manifestation of the behind the keyboard personality transformation that leads to this antisocial exchange rather than what would occur during face to face dialogue.

microstrip · Aug 25, 2015

Caesar,

Why are some audiophiles so interested in explaining/analyzing other audiophiles behavior?

I thought audiophiles would mainly interested in debating their equipment and their rooms, how they perform and how to improve them, including related matters such as recordings.

IMHO audiophile therapy is not an healthy subject for an open forum, specially if it is called WhatsBestForum. YMMV.

caesar · Aug 25, 2015

microstrip said:
Caesar,

Why are some audiophiles so interested in explaining/analyzing other audiophiles behavior?

I thought audiophiles would mainly interested in debating their equipment and their rooms, how they perform and how to improve them, including related matters such as recordings.

IMHO audiophile therapy is not an healthy subject for an open forum, specially if it is called WhatsBestForum. YMMV.

I hear you. I'm interested in the human phenomena as much as anything in this hobby. And if you look at why certain brands/ types of sound are successful, there is frequently a human behavior explanation - as well as others. Some notice it, others don't, and yet others don't care.

Furthermore if you start talking about specific gear, and people don't share your taste or realism triggers, and yet you say something, they get upset. And I'm not even mentioning zealots who think the piece of gear they got is "the best"...

caesar · Aug 25, 2015

Audiophile Bill said:
I think you bring up an interesting observation that unfortunately ultimately requires a thorough examination of human psychology. However, as a casual observer of this phenomenon, it strikes me that it is not the act of contrasting views per se, rather the *manner* by which the exchange occurs. Specifically the normal social manners that people tend to abide by in face to face interactions goes out of the window and in comes quasi-psychopathic tendencies. The best analogy I can give is the atrocious behaviour that some drivers have whilst behind their armoured shell - gesticulations and foul language are common exchanges from behind the wheel - these same individuals just don't behave the same way when on foot / in person in public places.

So in sum, it is a manifestation of the behind the keyboard personality transformation that leads to this antisocial exchange rather than what would occur during face to face dialogue.

I think that's an outstanding point regarding the seeming interaction with a computer site vs. a human being. Yet I would assume that most of us on this site have developed very particular taste in gear, and people feel rejected, in a way, if you don't like what they like.

Phelonious Ponk · Aug 25, 2015

caesar said:
I think that's an outstanding point regarding the seeming interaction with a computer site vs. a human being. Yet I would assume that most of us on this site have developed very particular taste in gear, and people feel rejected, in a way, if you don't like what they like.

I don't think it has that much to do with tone. I've seen gear criticized in the most benign way, and the reaction is the same. The results the Martin Logans got in the Harman tests is a good example. Yes, the criticism got direct eventually, but it started off simply as reporting the results of the tests. The outcry was defining.

I think the psychology is pretty simple: This is one of those hobbies in which some people get in very deep, investing not only a lot of money, but a lot of time and heart. They see a manifestation of their intelligence, their passion, themselves in their systems. It's not surprising that some don't take criticism easily.

Tim

still-one · Aug 25, 2015

The only time I really become sensitive is if someone says Product A is junk or it sounds like crap. Now if someone says they prefer Product B over Product A I don't get worked up. There is a lot of gear I wouldn't own but that doesn't make it crap. If they are happy with their decision more power to them.

NorthStar · Aug 25, 2015

Yes, Bill above said it; human psychology. It's not just audiophiles and gear lovers and music lovers who are sensitive, it's everybody, even criminals in jail.

When criticized about something close to us, part of our character, philosophy, life's aspirations, material possessions that have a meaning to us...cars (transportation), audio gear (music listening), woman (wife/lover/friend), kids (children/education), work (jobs/professions/earning living), passion (hobby), we all are sensitive if it don't fit someone else's criteria...it is simple human psychology.

And we sure have zillions of examples all around us almost every single day...up to the point of totally losing control and affecting not only ourselves but our close environment too, including our friends, families and pets.

My car is the best, my gear is the best, my wife she's the best, my kids are the best, my home is the best, my garden and flowers and lawn look the best. I am the best, and nobody can take that away from me. :b ...If someone object to that...fine, but I'm still the best.

? This is PSYCHOLOGY, human behavior...senses and sensibilities.

NorthStar · Aug 25, 2015

Three days ago I started writing a new thread, about psychology...people's interactions on the internet, blogs, websites, forums, audio forums, audio/video forums...the full human encyclopedia...including real life.

I truly thought about it, and I know that it is important...because it is the essence of everything that is happening.
I spent hours and hours analyzing various aspects, constructing my new thread, with very smart links of articles written by smart people, and professional psychologists from all over the world. ...And relating to the internet, to us, to communication, to exchanges, and with the types of escalations it can lead to. It was in the Science and Technology Forum section of the forums.

And then, I deleted it all. Because I thought that people here wouldn't want to discuss this kind of subject @ WBForum.
And instead I simply posted a youtube video; The Awakening ... [POST]335125[/POST]

Now I'm glad to see that I'm not alone.

rockitman · Aug 25, 2015

What Bill says. Happens with car enthusiast sites too.

NorthStar · Aug 25, 2015

...Happens among scientists too.

DaveC · Aug 25, 2015

One thing I notice is the need for people to adapt beliefs and stick to them despite not knowing much about the subject and/or having no direct experience. I don't understand why it's so hard to keep an open mind.

Joe Whip · Aug 25, 2015

Probably because keeping an open mind requires too much work, too much introspection. It is far easier to be rigid and believe what you want to believe and stick to it come hell or high water. As the previous posters have noted, people in this and other hobbies are too sensitive in part because they view the fact that someone may not agree with their choices as an attack on them. I have no time for tubes but as far as I am concerned if you like them, go for it. Enjoy them. There is also way too much tribalism in this hobby as well which takes up the rancor another level.

Groucho · Aug 25, 2015

DaveC said:
I don't understand why it's so hard to keep an open mind.

Cursed is he that does not know when to shut his mind. An open mind is all very well in its way, but it ought not to be so open that there is no keeping anything in or out of it. It should be capable of shutting its doors sometimes, or it may be found a little draughty.

Let us keep our minds open by all means, as long as that means keeping our sense of perspective and seeking an understanding of the forces which mould the world. But don’t keep your minds so open that your brains fall out! There are still things in this world which are true and things which are false

But I think he thought that the object of opening the mind is simply opening the mind. Whereas I am incurably convinced that the object of opening the mind, as of opening the mouth, is to shut it again on something solid.

And many others!

http://quoteinvestigator.com/2014/04/13/open-mind/

Barry2013 · Aug 25, 2015

Hi Bob.
Have you ever read "The Darkness at Noon" by Arthur Koestler?
It's a classic novel of how belief and faith in something can be absolute and distorting - in this case communism but it applies to other things.
A real 20th century classic if you can get hold of a copy.

Brf · Aug 25, 2015

It's not necessarily the criticism but the manner in which it is offered that offends people.

I don't like chocolate, therefore, chocolate sucks and you are an idiot for liking it and you know nothing about the culinary arts.

NorthStar · Aug 25, 2015

Barry2013 said:
Hi Bob.
Have you ever read "The Darkness at Noon" by Arthur Koestler?
It's a classic novel of how belief and faith in something can be absolute and distorting - in this case communism but it applies to other things.
A real 20th century classic if you can get hold of a copy.

I just read the wiki entry, in full, including the last paragraph: "At the height of the media attention during the Monika Lewinsky scandal, US President Bill Clinton ..."

? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darkness_at_Noon

__________

The balance between the mind, the words, the transferred communication, the right and wrong interpretation, the sense of isolation, the pursuit of comprehension, everything...is a delicate rope hanging across a man-made bridge. It won't make the moon falling from the sky @ night.

The greatest secrets in man's history...he takes them to his death. And still, the moon keeps hanging in that dark night sky, with billion scintillating stars.
And man's brain can hold its own.

Phelonious Ponk · Aug 25, 2015

Brf said:
It's not necessarily the criticism but the manner in which it is offered that offends people.

I don't like chocolate, therefore, chocolate sucks and you are an idiot for liking it and you know nothing about the culinary arts.

Or the opposite; I like chocolate, therefore chocolate is superior (or if I can't quantify its superiority it is more "natural" or "musical") and therefore you must like it too. This is where it all goes off the rails, when we try to make a subjective choice into a pseudo-objective ranking; when we are incapable of accepting that you preferences are simply our preferences.

Tim

Why are audiophiles so sensitive?

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