I want your opinion on this statement

taters

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Jun 6, 2012
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I was watching an interview last night on Gene Simmons of the band Kiss. He made a statement that the music industry has been murdered with illegal downloading and that kids expect everything for free. He said you will never see any new bands be iconic in the future. He said the reason for that is there is no structure in the music business anymore and you need that structure to be an iconic band. He said from 1958 to 1988 there were hundreds of iconic bands. He asked Dan Rather to name an iconic band after 1988 and he could only name Nirvana. My question for you is to you think what he is saying is the truth or is he just pissed off because music tastes have changed and Kisses music is just yesterday's news.
 

spiritofmusic

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Jun 13, 2013
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Don't even get me started on this...:mad:!
I've never taken to Kiss, but he's dead right. A Perfect Storm of: anyone under 30 expecting to get their music (and movies etc) for free, explosion in media leading to overavailability w/no quality filter, slide in recording quality w/no consumer backlash, music just being a platform to sell phones, even less money for the artists, transient nature of life.
God, stop me now, my blood is boiling, and it's time to get some shut eye.
 

NorthStar

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Feb 8, 2011
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We live in different times, with more access, with more info...we have multiple choices and we adapt with those new choices.
But new music keeps being attractive, and with the new musicians playing it.

Iconic...we are making our own icons...instead of the business design making them for us. They can try all they want, they're way behind the technology now; they don't have control over it anymore...it's the technology that controls them...much more powerful than all those icons made by yesterday's ancient system.

Kiss, Gene, is losing future revenues now with the new system; them to adapt, @ being smarter instead of saying what he's saying.
And tomorrow Hollywood actors are going to lose more revenues too...well...the movie studios first.

This is a free country and people love it...they appreciate all the opportunities of this system. Live in the now...while the good times are still rolling.
Tomorrow there will be better times rolling for other people. ...And living in a better world than their own. ...It's all relative really...it goes with the times and the territory. ...The high speed Internet highway.

Lucky us we live where we live, in the same streaming neighborhood as Gene Simmons.

I know Gene, Neil and Prince won't agree with me...they have the right to...it's their future financial revenues that is in jeopardy.
It's tough to be a pop music star in 2015...different than in the 60s, 70s, 80s, 90s.

Many people worked very hard all their life, in the fields, getting up @ four in the morning, going to bed @ eight in the evening, seven days a week, for forty years, saving money for their retirement funds with funds managers, and bang, they lose everything! ...A tough stock market crisis.
Good investments but bad advice and overpriced stocks...and no one can escape...not even the solid core RRSP mutual funds.

It's tough to be a pop star...tough to become a musician icon today. It's tough for them to secure their future, when all their fans can get their music for free. And it's tough to sell products like electric cars, all that jazz.

Today you can stream and download almost anything, including love. ...Love is becoming free. ...Sex will soon follow, and with it drugs and rock and roll music. :b
 
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taters

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Jun 6, 2012
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We live in different times, with more access, with more info...we have multiple choices and we adapt with those new choices.
But new music keeps being attractive, and with the new musicians playing it.

Iconic...we are making our own icons...instead of the business design making them for us. They can try all they want, they're way behind the technology now; they don't have control over it anymore...it's the technology that controls them...much more powerful than all those icons made by yesterday's ancient system.

Kiss, Gene, is losing future revenues now with the new system; them to adapt, @ being smarter instead of saying what he's saying.
And tomorrow Hollywood actors are going to lose more revenues too...well...the movie studios first.

This is a free country and people love it...they appreciate all the opportunities of this system. Live in the now...while the good times are still rolling.
Tomorrow there will be better times rolling for other people. ...And living in a better world than their own. ...It's all relative really...it goes with the times and the territory. ...The high speed Internet highway.

Lucky us we live where we live, in the same streaming neighborhood as Gene Simmons.

I know Gene, Neil and Prince won't agree with me...they have the right to...it's their future financial revenues that is in jeopardy.
It's tough to be a pop music star in 2015...different than in the 60s, 70s, 80s, 90s.

Many people worked very hard all their life, in the fields, getting up @ four in the morning, going to bed @ eight in the evening, seven days a week, for forty years, saving money for their retirement funds with funds managers, and bang, they lose everything! ...A tough stock market crisis.
Good investments but bad advice and overpriced stocks...and no one can escape...not even the solid core RRSP mutual funds.

It's tough to be a pop star...tough to become a musician icon today. It's tough for them to secure their future, when all their fans can get their music for free. And it's tough to sell products like electric cars, all that jazz.

Today you can stream and download almost anything, including love. ...Love is becoming free. ...Sex will soon follow, and with it drugs and rock and roll music. :b


I agree with most of your statements except the one of free sex. As long as woman are in control (and yes the men know what I am talking about) you are going to have to pay for sex one way or the other. I don't think the Internet is ever going to change that.
 

BlueFox

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Nov 8, 2013
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I remember Metallica complaining the same way about Napster in the early 90s. I finally got tired of reading that so I went to Frys, bought some nice Yamaha computer speakers, loaded Napster and Winamp, and then downloaded every Metallica song I could find. Surprisingly, I thought, "This sounds pretty good", and started looking for new music.
 

dan31

Well-Known Member
Jul 22, 2010
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Gene's right. As consumers it was different for us as well. I remember listening to the radio for hours. No cable tv, no video games, less distraction from the music.
 

Robh3606

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Aug 24, 2010
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Ah baloney never heard of U2. You Tube is the new king look at viewing numbers on some peoples sites. Check out Lindsey Sterling she didn't have what it took to be successful as an example of their collective brilliance.

Rob:)
 

taters

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Jun 6, 2012
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Ah baloney never heard of U2. You Tube is the new king look at viewing numbers on some peoples sites. Check out Lindsey Sterling she didn't have what it took to be successful as an example of their collective brilliance.

Rob:)


Gene Simmons is not referring to you tube or Instagram. What he is saying is because there is no structure in the music business the day of the Iconic star is over.
 

treitz3

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Dec 25, 2011
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Hello and good evening to you taters. It has not only been murdered from illegal downloading but from the desecration of the music itself via compression, loudness wars, the convenience crowd, repetition, electronica, etc...IMO only.

A band to grow and survive today would have to actually play music (preferably an album that tells a story) that will stand the test of time (not a monthly chart)....and be original, not skating on the illusions or grandeur of yesteryear.

Tom
 

taters

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Jun 6, 2012
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Hello and good evening to you taters. It has not only been murdered from illegal downloading but from the desecration of the music itself via compression, loudness wars, the convenience crowd, repetition, electronica, etc...IMO only.

A band to grow and survive today would have to actually play music (preferably an album that tells a story) that will stand the test of time (not a monthly chart)....and be original, not skating on the illusions or grandeur of yesteryear.

Tom


You make some very valid points.
 

infinitely baffled

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i believe that what we have now is closer to true meritocracy. you no longer have gatekeepers like record companies or radio stations exerting such influence and this can only be a good thing. gone are the days of hype rollercoasters so i can see why kiss would be in mourning - i challenge anyone to name 2 songs by kiss - serious bands these days have to stand on the strength of their material if they want any more than brief success, if we ignore the teenybopper talent show inventions. and i think we can all agree that we're happy to ignore them.

i cannot speak for the US but in the uk we have had groups like Gorrilaz, Leftfield, Underworld, Massive Attack and Alt-j consistently displaying true genius without requiring (or receiving) much hype or airplay. if you are good enough, you will find an audience and flourish, however if you rely on hype, make-up and frightening interviewers you would likely fail in today's market.

Festivals have never been more popular than they are now. if you hear a track you love the internet will help you find it. at the top end you can introduce yourself to new artists and genres online with no risk and then buy the audophile format of your choice. i would say that both for the music lover and new band trying to make it, times have never been better :cool:
 

NorthStar

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Feb 8, 2011
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I was watching an interview last night on Gene Simmons of the band Kiss. He made a statement that the music industry has been murdered with illegal downloading and that kids expect everything for free. He said you will never see any new bands be iconic in the future. He said the reason for that is there is no structure in the music business anymore and you need that structure to be an iconic band. He said from 1958 to 1988 there were hundreds of iconic bands. He asked Dan Rather to name an iconic band after 1988 and he could only name Nirvana. My question for you is to you think what he is saying is the truth or is he just pissed off because music tastes have changed and Kisses music is just yesterday's news.

I agree with most of your statements except the one of free sex. As long as woman are in control (and yes the men know what I am talking about) you are going to have to pay for sex one way or the other. I don't think the Internet is ever going to change that.

What Gene Simmons from Kiss is saying about music downloading/streaming new business plan and the lost of music icons today, in comparison to the sex/porn industry on the Internet (viewing/streaming), and also on what Neil Young and Prince said recently on their removal of all their music from the streaming music companies because of poor sound quality (but they don't say directly that it also affects their financial revenues/future royalties from their artistic/musical talents), drew me to this verisimilitude we live in today with the Internet on how it affects all icons/artists, not only in the music industry (Led Zeppelin, Metallica, Kiss, AC/DC, ...) but also in all other industries, from Hollywood to Florida to movie and porn stars* (sex, money, rock&roll).

Who profit the most now? ...The managers...the streaming music companies and the movie downloading companies with the people behind...the organizers, the perpetrators, the entire free access created by the Internet with all the viewers and listeners. ...It's like a vice that we can't get rid off, and we all created it, including Gene Simmons, Neil Young and Prince. They are part of it like all their fans. ...So, Prince and Neil Young decided to not be part of it anymore and removed all their music from all streaming music companies, except for Tidal from Prince.

These talented artists/musicians are well outspoken people...they say what they have to say regarding the world we live in and about the music industry.
Iconic music bands like Metallica, Kiss, Guns & Roses, etc., ...are the last vestiges from yesterday's old music business' strategy.
Today the new iconic music artists/musicians are a different breed...more discreet, harder to find within so much more music bands of all levels...from real real bad to excellent.

The Internet is the full globe...much more access to much more great musicians that we would never know if we couldn't stream music like we can now.
So, these guys, Simmons and all, they can say all they want, complaint the way they do without telling us directly that it is their bank accounts that they are more concerned about, the fact stays that the benefits are way more advantageous than their selfish egocentric financial state-of-mind. ...They only see their own disadvantages without looking @ the full picture...other artists/musicians that we can finally discover and appreciate more for their true talents...purity and creativity for the music they love playing and sharing.

I'd say to Gene Simmons and Neil young and Prince and Metallica: Do as Bob Dylan do, Play Live.

_________

* As for the above 'connection' I made between the streaming music business and the sex/porn streaming online business:


=> Where are the new iconic stars now, now that VHS tapes are dead, and people are not buying DVDs and 3D porn movies on Blu-ray, but instead are downloading illegally from an industry in deep decline and created by the profit makers...all of us one way or another.

The music industry has been murdered with today's technologies. ...And all of us we are using those technologies...on our iPhones, iPads, iMacs, and all that Microsoft jazz.
Do we think that we can stop this madness? ...Just no way Jose; it's here only to expand more and more...so might as well accept it and adapt with it the best we can...by buying vinyls and 8-track tapes from the music we love and created by the true talents/artists/music icons from our youth and way before...Mozart, Back, Beethoven, Chopin and the rest of the gang.
 

GaryProtein

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Jul 25, 2012
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We live in different times, with more access, with more info...we have multiple choices and we adapt with those new choices.
Today you can stream and download almost anything, including love. ...Love is becoming free. ...Sex will soon follow, and with it drugs and rock and roll music. :b

Sex already is free.

It's love [nurturing and maintaining a relationship] that costs money. :D
 

valkyrie

Well-Known Member
Sep 12, 2011
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Bravo Northstar. Said it all; life is pretty darn tough and seems to be a very leveling process. But hey - we are living in a "golden age" of audio. This audio age requires a lot of gold.
 

esldude

New Member
Ah baloney never heard of U2. You Tube is the new king look at viewing numbers on some peoples sites. Check out Lindsey Sterling she didn't have what it took to be successful as an example of their collective brilliance.

Rob:)

I think this is an important view into how things are different that Gene doesn't realize.

From time to time I get together with a few of my more varied friends (various ages, interests, and inclinations). We sit before a large screen TV connected to a laptop. Our host lets each of us pick a song or artist we like that is more or less new to us. Or find a youtube or other video of an old artist doing something overlooked. We have a middling quality high end system connected for sound. Finding good, interesting worthwhile artists isn't all that hard. I run across one or two, each and everyone else does. Not all are to all people's liking. We all take some time to hear them. Sometimes we get something close to universal interest, and our host does some searching, comes up with info or more videos or audios. We dig a little deeper. Almost everyone makes a note of two or three artists to go get their music. We make the loop through everyone choosing a song two or three times at least.

Now it is different than way back when I or a friend or three would come over with some new album. We would cue it up on the old turntable and dig it for 40 minutes or so. This is fast paced, more varied, a bit more chaotic, and yet socially not really so different. It is the new version of the old thing about people digging on new to them music. No one brings an album or CD or even a memory stick in the past 18 months. It is all out there somewhere. You bring your taste and your knowledge of where to look.

This is not going to give us a new Kiss or Metallica or Led Zep or the Beatles or ZZ Top. You get at most Michael Buble or John Mayall or people who never become even that recognizable or widely known. Creating a music collection isn't amenable to that either. Things are more transient. And especially the younger people just have a faith, and a life experience that says a collection isn't necessary. There will always be more new good stuff than you have time for plus the very, very, very best of the old stuff will still be around somehow too. So far it is. The more companies try and corral that the more it is like water squishing thru the grasp of their greedy hands closing in on it. Even realizing such greed can be good as it is how bands used to get funded, recorded and sent out to tour, it just doesn't work anymore. Greed or more politely self interest had good effects. It plays out very differently than it did even a decade ago.

PS-Thanks for the mention of Lindsey Stirling. See, never heard of her. Just listened to a couple. Liked "Roundtable Revival" quite a lot as well as "Beyond the Veil."
 
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NorthStar

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There is/was only one King, and he has left the building quite a while ago...Elvis. He was the King of all iconic Rock&Roll music bands and singers, and he was on vinyls and tapes.

Then Queen came, Yes, Genesis, Jethro Tull, Ozzy, ...all after Frank Sinatra, Nat King Cole, Louis Armstrong, Chet Baker, Billie Holiday, Ella Fitzgerald and Nina Simone.

Beatles, Bee Gees, the Stones...all pop rock musicians singers with true icon stickers.
 

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