C-J's new gear, + Lamm outstanding!

Big Dog RJ

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Feb 2, 2012
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G'day to all tube lovers, and c-j fans.
Ok, well after a good break and few weeks off it was a real treat to experience some great new gear from c-j. The list as follows:
power amps: LP260m, ARTsa+, ART monoblocks, LP125sa, and ClassicSE, plus Lamm monoblocks (dealer's personnel system with Quads! too exciting to even talk about...).
Preamps: ACT2 series 2, ART, GAT and ET5, and a few other preamps lying around from Audio Note, McIntosh and Ayre.
Speakers: various types & brands from, SF & ML's to Wilson's; to mention some that stood out were Quad, Martin Logan, and the new Alexia and Duette.
Digital Sources: ranged from Puccini & Weiss Dacs, music servers from Naim & Wadia, and SACD units from McIntosh, Meitner, Ayre and Marantz.
Analogue Sources: mostly two brands from VPI, and another personnel favourite from Linn. A few other ones hooked up from McIntosh and Project used for demo as well.
Cables and Interconnects: mostly from Nordost, and MIT, including a few iterations from Transparent and Audioquest.
Power conditioning / AC power distribution blocks: mostly from Nordost, Transparent Tec, and MIT.

One thing I noticed, the people that mostly dealt with c-j gear, had the simpler systems installed, and the demo was outstanding! One that remains faithful in terms of actual scale, and very high quality palpable imaging was with Quad electrostats, the GAT and Lamm signature series SET monoblocks. Another fantastic overall sound, which to me also had zero listener fatigue, was the new Alexia or was it the Shasha series III..., they nearly look alike. Another fantastic system for a dynamic driver type, the Duette, which to me outshines other expensive driver types by a far margin! Yes, I think it was the Alexia and they are beauties! Driven with the ART amps and GAT, this was an exceptional performance with classical music.

Another thing I noticed, is that the S-pore dollar and Aussie dollar are not too far away. Just a few bucks difference, and it seems like our $AUD has definitely dropped... At the end of the day, my dealer buddy did give me a fantastic offer for the ARTsa but I was too fixated on the Lamm's! I also did a quick costing on shipping, insurance and customs clearing, nope not worth it. Plus after sales service is going to be a question when I need it in Aus. So, I just headed to Tiffany's and bought the "good wife" a nice diamond ring, and yes, she's dam happy!

I have decided to hold off all purchases, since my new experiences with SET amps from Lamm, in a proper set up with the very same electrostats that I have worked so wonderfully well, has now put me completely off the rails... Although the ART amps were awesome, plus the new LP260m's, that GAT and Lamm combination is something like honey drizzled on your favourite Ben & Jerry's!

A new target has been formed gentlemen! The Lamm it is; but for now I am totally content with my humble MV60se, ACT2 and Quad combination, just one thing missing, ah! yes that cigar and scotch...
Have a good one fellas, enjoy your music.
Cheers, RJ
 

joeinid

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Mar 14, 2011
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RJ,

I love your enthusiasm. I've been looking at Lamm myself but maybe I need to look into a different model. I'd die for the ML3 combo. Sadly that is not in the cards but I'm sure the more affordable gear has the same DNA. So happy you had a great time.
 

LL21

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Dec 26, 2010
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Great report!!! Big fan of the CJ GAT, and it gets better if you really isolate it well, top, bottom and EAT Tube guards, plus some good grounding (Tripoint/Entreq).

With my Wilsons, I have to admit the big Lamms would be awesome...of course, so is the price!!!

How did the big ART amps different from the big Lamms? Most curious!!!
 

Steve Williams

Site Founder, Site Owner, Administrator
Great report!!! Big fan of the CJ GAT, and it gets better if you really isolate it well, top, bottom and EAT Tube guards, plus some good grounding (Tripoint/Entreq).

With my Wilsons, I have to admit the big Lamms would be awesome...of course, so is the price!!!

How did the big ART amps different from the big Lamms? Most curious!!!

I'd be interested as well

The sonic signature of his ML3 Signature series has a midrange that is difficult to give up
 

LL21

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Dec 26, 2010
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I'd be interested as well

The sonic signature of his ML3 Signature series has a midrange that is difficult to give up

Bump...any notes on how ART and big Lamm's compare, Big Dog RJ?
 

strapper211

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Aug 6, 2013
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Hi,
The Lamm ML3's and the rest of the signature series are the last stop.I have had them for about 18 months and will never part with them.Very few things in this life are that certain.
Big Price = Investment for Life.

Robert
 

Big Dog RJ

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Feb 2, 2012
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Greetings from Melbourne! Sorry for the delay lads; my best mate just had a lovely kiddo at the age of 40! His wife is doing well and all is fine.
We just had to light a cigar for the occasion with a quick beer of course, and all is well so far and resting...

Ah! yes, getting back to the audio; the ART amps are in a different category altogether compared to SET designs, as you are all aware of.
In terms of push-pull ultra linear or pentode drive category, the ART amplifier is probably every audiophile's/music lover's amp of the decade! What we have here is certainly a pair of monoblocks that are very high-end indeed, and an amplifier that delivers a top-notch musical spectrum, obviously an amplifier of top choice! They do everything just about right, well controlled bass (and plenty of), great mid-range and smooth airy highs, awesome soundstage and that wonderful "musicality" from c-j. No other design does this so well, this is a signature sound of c-j.

Having said that, there are many other fantastic designs out there that do things a bit better compared to c-j in certain areas of course, and ones that cost several times more. Spending colossal amounts on marginal improvements doesn't really make any sense, to me at least. To me, what justifies an upgrade would be a considerable improvement, one that is so dramatic it can be felt through the entire frequency spectrum, not just in the bass, mids or highs... It must force you to listen with more intensity, and emotion, and make you totally engaged with the music of your favourite recordings.

I have come across many audiophiles wanting more of this and that but cannot seem to figure out what exactly they're after! Some want massive amounts of bass, others loud ass mids, or thrilling highs, and chase after something, losing out on the overall music, and the cycle goes on... Changing of speakers, ranging from huge towers to small monitors that seem to portray everything right in terms of scale and imaging, then something lacks in soundstage. Along the way they realize the room plays a huge factor, cables and interconnects play a critical role, hec! even the lighting in the room plays a huge role, and the mood of your wife! for those who have wives at least...

What I have certainly learnt in all these years, is when you hear something special, and strikes all the good notes, keeps you captivated and totally immersed in the sound, that's the sound you're after, regardless of cost. Aim for that and start building towards it, eventually you'll get there even though it may cost 100 grand.

That's now my goal, and new set standard; I've already got the speakers, the pre-amp and source (they are all fine for me), including the ancillary equipment; now all I need are the Lamm's!

As Steve and others have mentioned, the Lamm ML series mid-range is something extraordinary, and when partnered with Quad ESL's that are known for their mid-range, this is one sweet awesome combination! Once you're hooked on, everything else falls into place - palpable bass, smooth highs, with a phenomenal soundstage! This is system where everything is just dandy, scale, height, width, depth, ease of listening, and all of this delivered with just a handful of "pure class A" watts, what more do you really need?

I sincerely prefer this type of design to something that weighs a ton, and has so many output tubes, one could light up a city with!

All the best to all who are still seeking that golden sound, I have certainly found it, and will definitely have the ML signature series someday, the ML2 series is fine for me!
It would be interesting to see who or which designer beats this one by a "far" margin...
Cheers, RJ
 

LL21

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Dec 26, 2010
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Thanks for the feedback Big Dog RJ.
 

JackD201

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Saw on youtube a pair of ML2.2s driving YGs. The new topology kicks butt. I didn't imagine they could drive YG Hailey's that easily.
 

Big Dog RJ

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Yes exactly! This is what I'm talking about. The bigger amplike the Art and other designs from Arc, vtl, mcintosh and the best of the rest would have no problems whatsoever driving difficult loads from such tube designs, and they do sound awefully good; especially the big Art's.
Then when you go up a level and pricing gets to over 20 grand, I think the law of diminishing returns sets in. So it has to sound good just because it costs roughly close to a house! Then again there are only a handful that do cost a bomb, and do sound flawless; Lamm is certainly one of them.
I clearly remember the sound coming off the previous iterations of the ML series and they were just as good! The only thing here was they needed to be matched with the right load. Whereas the newer versions of the ML series such as the 2.2 and 3 series are certainly capable of driving virtually anything.

Not only is it just great sound, it totally captivates your attention and immerses you in the whole performance like no other. Nearly all high-end gear would sound great, fantastic bass, smooth highs and glorious midrange... but the Lamm's take this to another level, along with a soundstage that is remarkable!
You have to certainly experience this to understand why I'm jumping for joy!

At the moment I cannot find any previous models of the ml2series. The Aus dollar has slumped and even in Spore these things are dam expensive. I think I'll need to start that lottery ritual again for sure. ..
Till then cheers to all, those other luck audiophiles out there with Lamm's, yes I do envy you!
Take it easy and enjoy your music.
RJ
 

JackD201

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Keith (nephilim) will be moving to 2.2s pretty soon. Too bad his 2.1s are spoken for RJ. I'll keep my eyes open for you though.

Oh, here's that clip. Haileys on 18 watts and the 2.2s driven directly by an Ayon player

 

LL21

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Dec 26, 2010
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Yes exactly! This is what I'm talking about. The bigger amplike the Art and other designs from Arc, vtl, mcintosh and the best of the rest would have no problems whatsoever driving difficult loads from such tube designs, and they do sound awefully good; especially the big Art's.
Then when you go up a level and pricing gets to over 20 grand, I think the law of diminishing returns sets in. So it has to sound good just because it costs roughly close to a house! Then again there are only a handful that do cost a bomb, and do sound flawless; Lamm is certainly one of them.
I clearly remember the sound coming off the previous iterations of the ML series and they were just as good! The only thing here was they needed to be matched with the right load. Whereas the newer versions of the ML series such as the 2.2 and 3 series are certainly capable of driving virtually anything.

Not only is it just great sound, it totally captivates your attention and immerses you in the whole performance like no other. Nearly all high-end gear would sound great, fantastic bass, smooth highs and glorious midrange... but the Lamm's take this to another level, along with a soundstage that is remarkable!
You have to certainly experience this to understand why I'm jumping for joy!

At the moment I cannot find any previous models of the ml2series. The Aus dollar has slumped and even in Spore these things are dam expensive. I think I'll need to start that lottery ritual again for sure. ..
Till then cheers to all, those other luck audiophiles out there with Lamm's, yes I do envy you!
Take it easy and enjoy your music.
RJ

RJ, I know zilch about Lamms other than what I have read...and I nearly bought ML2s myself before going with Gryphon. A couple people on this forum nearly got me to press the button, and I remain in their debt for their great help and advice.

From what I recall, there are more than a few people who clearly preferred the ML2 original over the ML2.1...how either compares to ML2.2 I cannot say, though I have heard exceptionally good things about it. Bear in mind the ML2 can go for much less than the 2.1 on the second hand market.
 

Big Dog RJ

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Feb 2, 2012
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G'day mate, thanks for your reply.
Agreed, the original ml2 series is fantastic, and they can drive just about anything. The problem is Australia, pricing is way over the top here, and it makes no sense in importing anything high-end to Australia because of the shipping, customs and duty charges one would have to pay. They do this purposely to protect the local distributor and dealers. The only thing they import to this country willingly are race horses!

I know your Gryphon and Gat is an awesome combination because a good mate of mine is using a gryphon to drive the top of the line Marten's. He has two preamps, an Act2 and a Vitus Audio. He absolutely loves itand thinks the Lamm's are a rip off compared to what his gryphon can do. It basically boils down to what each person's preference is, and he mostly listens to light rock, nickel back, dire straits, queen, sting and the like. He's been to nearly every live concert of stings and even has a photo of the two of them as you enter his listening room. He's a bass player himself and really cranks up loud! His system is no doubt awesome and truly live scale, too bloody loud for me though.
He thinks my Quads and cj sound is like a blonde anorexic! He just doesn't like that laid back sound and thinks Lamm and the other pricy SET designs are a joke...
So there you it, it is certainly not for everyone but then again nothing really is...
I'll be meeting up with him this weekend again, he's got a gig in town. I bet he's going to ask me how's that skinny british chic doing at home, referring to the quads of course...
I sincerely think the Gat and gryphon is outstanding with Wilson's of course. Lamm's would be a totally different revelation, yes.
I would have to keep a long one out for this because it is highly unlikely I will be able to get hold of a pair of Lamm's in Australia for under 20 grand.
Till then I'll just enjoy what I have, it's good enough for now. Cheers mate, RJ
 

Steve Williams

Site Founder, Site Owner, Administrator
G'day mate, thanks for your reply.
Agreed, the original ml2 series is fantastic, and they can drive just about anything. The problem is Australia, pricing is way over the top here, and it makes no sense in importing anything high-end to Australia because of the shipping, customs and duty charges one would have to pay. They do this purposely to protect the local distributor and dealers. The only thing they import to this country willingly are race horses!

I know your Gryphon and Gat is an awesome combination because a good mate of mine is using a gryphon to drive the top of the line Marten's. He has two preamps, an Act2 and a Vitus Audio. He absolutely loves itand thinks the Lamm's are a rip off compared to what his gryphon can do. It basically boils down to what each person's preference is, and he mostly listens to light rock, nickel back, dire straits, queen, sting and the like. He's been to nearly every live concert of stings and even has a photo of the two of them as you enter his listening room. He's a bass player himself and really cranks up loud! His system is no doubt awesome and truly live scale, too bloody loud for me though.
He thinks my Quads and cj sound is like a blonde anorexic! He just doesn't like that laid back sound and thinks Lamm and the other pricy SET designs are a joke...
So there you it, it is certainly not for everyone but then again nothing really is...
I'll be meeting up with him this weekend again, he's got a gig in town. I bet he's going to ask me how's that skinny british chic doing at home, referring to the quads of course...
I sincerely think the Gat and gryphon is outstanding with Wilson's of course. Lamm's would be a totally different revelation, yes.
I would have to keep a long one out for this because it is highly unlikely I will be able to get hold of a pair of Lamm's in Australia for under 20 grand.
Till then I'll just enjoy what I have, it's good enough for now. Cheers mate, RJ
Not so sure the ML2's and 2.1's can drive anything

I've owned the ML 2'1's before my now ML3/LL1 Signature amp/preamp. At 18 wpc it could certainly drive most speakers above at least 90 Db efficient but I could certainly find times when the amp was clipping

So similarly with the ML3 Signature at 30 wpc where IMO it performs best on speakers above 90 Db efficient.

Once you own a Lamm amp and preamp you won't need another amp. Vladimir's mid range on his amps IMO is second to none.However I am biased as I own them and sell them
 

LL21

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Dec 26, 2010
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G'day mate, thanks for your reply...
...I know your Gryphon and Gat is an awesome combination because a good mate of mine is using a gryphon to drive the top of the line Marten's. He has two preamps, an Act2 and a Vitus Audio. He absolutely loves...what his gryphon can do...I sincerely think the Gat and gryphon is outstanding with Wilson's of course. Lamm's would be a totally different revelation, yes...

Wow...always nice to hear. Thanks for that. I will say, I have no desire except for educational purposes to hear other electronics. I have heard some of the more recent releases...D'Agostino, Naim Statement and Constellation Altairs...all impressive. But fortunately, while I have certainly been blessed to be able to upgrade in the last 20 years, I have never been the kind to hanker after the new new thing...and at the moment, that remains very true. I have aiming for Zanden, CJ, Gryphon for many years and having gotten there 6 years ago and extremely happy.

I wonder if someday you might come across a well priced Gryphon Diablo integrated...and whether that might tempt you?
 

JackD201

WBF Founding Member
Apr 20, 2010
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Hi Keith,

I think it's Karen Souza.
 

Big Dog RJ

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Feb 2, 2012
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463
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Melbourne
Hey ll21, good to hear that you are very happy with the Gryphon & cj partnership. I am sure it will certainly outperform many designs to come.

The funny thing is I ventured out there to listen to the ultimate on c-j gear, like their new lp260, lp125sa, and the Art amps of course. Ended up going nuts with the Lamm's because the dealer mate's very own system at home was actually the mlseries 2.2 with Quads, the very same esl that I have. Since I don't listen to anything close to loud, not even the slightest crank up, and most of my listening is after midnight. The 18 or so watts of class A is ample! We also have similar tastes in music and prefer a very relaxing laid back sound with all those details and nuances that are very aparent around midnight. ..

If I cannot get hold of a mlseries within the next few years, I will probably settle for an Artsa, and this I know very well because I have taken it for a spin on my Quads.
The starting prices for the Lamm's are around 50 grand and upwards. The new ml2.2 goes for around 80 grand for a pair. I really don't think this would settle in nicely with the "good wife" even if I had the means...
Lamm's for me would be a retirement package I reckon. By then hearing wouldn't be able to distinguish between a Lamm and a lamb...
Thanks for your feedback, much appreciated.
Cheers to all, RJ
 

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