Anyone seriously audition CAT gear and decide against it? Anyone switch from CAT?

caesar

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May 30, 2010
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I have heard a lot of tube gear in my life, and I like most of it. But I get the impression that, CAT may be the best tube gear there is today.

Yes, there are exceptions: Atmasphere and Soundlab or NOLA and ARC.

Hearing CAT on several occasions, here's what it seems to do: natural sound, insane detail resolution that doesn't take away from musical enjoyment, great macrodynamics, great microdynamics, awesome bass that kicks like a mule (if on recording), which very unusual for a tube gear, extended highs (also, very unusual for a tube gear), awesome transparency, midrange that is not bloated or veiled, etc.

The head guy at CAT seems to be a genius with very high multiple intelligence in math/ science as well as having very high musical/ hearing intelligence. However, the guy seems to be very stingy with review samples. Kudos to Jacob Heilbrunn for making a trip to Wilson's John Goliath to hear and report on it driving the Alexias.

Has anyone here owned CAT and switched? If so to what?

Anyone seriously audition CAT and choose another brand? If so, which one?

In essence, this gear may be the panacea: take the best of tubes and the best of SS and put it in one. Anyone disagree?
 

Bruce B

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Apr 25, 2010
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The ONLY reason I switched from CAT is because it doesn't have balanced in/out. Hard to implement that in a studio setting.
 

mep

Member Sponsor & WBF Founding Member
Apr 20, 2010
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I don't know what tube gear you have been listening to, but having "extended highs" is not unusual for tube gear.
 

MadFloyd

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May 30, 2010
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I have heard a lot of tube gear in my life, and I like most of it. But I get the impression that, CAT may be the best tube gear there is today.

Yes, there are exceptions: Atmasphere and Soundlab or NOLA and ARC.

Hearing CAT on several occasions, here's what it seems to do: natural sound, insane detail resolution that doesn't take away from musical enjoyment, great macrodynamics, great microdynamics, awesome bass that kicks like a mule (if on recording), which very unusual for a tube gear, extended highs (also, very unusual for a tube gear), awesome transparency, midrange that is not bloated or veiled, etc.

The head guy at CAT seems to be a genius with very high multiple intelligence in math/ science as well as having very high musical/ hearing intelligence. However, the guy seems to be very stingy with review samples. Kudos to Jacob Heilbrunn for making a trip to Wilson's John Goliath to hear and report on it driving the Alexias.

Has anyone here owned CAT and switched? If so to what?

Anyone seriously audition CAT and choose another brand? If so, which one?

In essence, this gear may be the panacea: take the best of tubes and the best of SS and put it in one. Anyone disagree?

Never heard of CAT. Is that California Audio Technologies? Their website boasts of the materials etc but doesn't actually list any products.

Where did you see Jacob Heilbrunn's article?
 

caesar

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May 30, 2010
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I don't know what tube gear you have been listening to, but having "extended highs" is not unusual for tube gear.

I don't want to come across like a snob, but I don't think all the tube gear highs are created equal. What I am talking about here is the resolution of detail, microdynamics and nuance on, say, drum brushes, that I haven't heard anyone else do. But you may be right and it could be just me...
 

caesar

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May 30, 2010
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Never heard of CAT. Is that California Audio Technologies? Their website boasts of the materials etc but doesn't actually list any products.

Where did you see Jacob Heilbrunn's article?

Mad Floyd,

I think you hit the crux of the problem - the company doesn't seem to have a website. It doesn't make sense to me, unless the company wants to manage demand very closely.

Here's the link to Heilbrunn's blog:

http://www.theabsolutesound.com/articles/a-visit-with-wilson-audios-john-giolas/
 

mep

Member Sponsor & WBF Founding Member
Apr 20, 2010
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I don't want to come across like a snob, but I don't think all the tube gear highs are created equal. What I am talking about here is the resolution of detail, microdynamics and nuance on, say, drum brushes, that I haven't heard anyone else do. But you may be right and it could be just me...

There is a huge difference between being "created equal" and the fact that most modern hi-end tube gear does have extended highs.
 
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Jeffy

Well-Known Member
Apr 27, 2014
475
171
348
Orchard Lake, MI
I have had various CAT preamps during the years. My last one was the ultimate. The preamp is very revealing and dynamic, but to me it is very forward or upfront sounding. I wanted to be able to relax with the music and did not want it in my face all the time. I first switched to the VTL 7 , then the Audio Research Ref 2 mark 2, then the VAC preamp. The VAC was the best, now I'm using an Absolare preamp. I never had Ken Stevens CAT amps.
 

Occam

[Industry Expert]
Dec 15, 2010
117
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0
NYC
I have had various CAT preamps during the years. My last one was the ultimate. The preamp is very revealing and dynamic, but to me it is very forward or upfront sounding...

Wheres the fun in getting tube kit unless you've the joy of playing slap and tickle with it? Anyone has the opportunity to tune the CAT pre to pretty much voice it as one prefers. Last time I talked to Ken the EH6922 was the bees knees, and was sufficient for any needs. I'm certainly not going to argue with the designer, but I've found very positive results with tube rolling. [same goes for Tim d'PVC, he'll maintain that any Phillips origin ECC88/PCC88/6922 will sound the same] I run my CAT pre with various ECC188s (milspec 6922s) and have them from the various Phillips plants, Mullards from Mitchum in GB, Amperex from Heerlen, Netherlands, Dario from Surenes, France and Siemens from Germany. They all sound subjectively different and allow pretty much any sound one could want.
Same goes for isolation devices and power cords. The CAT preamps benefit substantially from subjective optimization. Black Diamond Racing Cones work a treat under the power supply to minimize any forwardness. YMMV

Then again, I can certainly understand folk who simply don't want to muck about with such efforts.

FWIW,
Paul
 

jtinn

Industry Expert
Apr 20, 2010
503
70
483
I have heard a lot of tube gear in my life, and I like most of it. But I get the impression that, CAT may be the best tube gear there is today.

Yes, there are exceptions: Atmasphere and Soundlab or NOLA and ARC.

Hearing CAT on several occasions, here's what it seems to do: natural sound, insane detail resolution that doesn't take away from musical enjoyment, great macrodynamics, great microdynamics, awesome bass that kicks like a mule (if on recording), which very unusual for a tube gear, extended highs (also, very unusual for a tube gear), awesome transparency, midrange that is not bloated or veiled, etc.

The head guy at CAT seems to be a genius with very high multiple intelligence in math/ science as well as having very high musical/ hearing intelligence. However, the guy seems to be very stingy with review samples. Kudos to Jacob Heilbrunn for making a trip to Wilson's John Goliath to hear and report on it driving the Alexias.

Has anyone here owned CAT and switched? If so to what?

Anyone seriously audition CAT and choose another brand? If so, which one?

In essence, this gear may be the panacea: take the best of tubes and the best of SS and put it in one. Anyone disagree?

I have a number of customers who have owned CAT amps and preamps and have traded them in to me after hearing the darTZeel gear. Each of those customers have no regrets and still own the darTZeels.

I have spent quite a bit of time with numerous CAT models and I would consider them if I were looking for a tube amp and owned difficult speakers to drive. They seem have the ability to drive speakers one would think would be too difficult for a 150 wpc tube amplifier. The sound is very good, but if I were looking for a tube amp and had speakers that were easy to drive, I would choose something else.
 

DaveyF

Well-Known Member
Jul 31, 2010
6,129
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La Jolla, Calif USA
JTinn, that depends on whether you are in the ss camp or the tube camp. The Dart's are GREAT ss amps, no doubt; BUT they don't have the same characteristics as the CAT amps...nor do they have quite the macro and micro dynamic shadings as the CAT amps IMO. OTOH, they are probably a LOT easier to live with and maintain than tube amps.
I agree completely with Paul ( Occam), the preamp can be altered to taste, depending on the tube that is 'rolled' in. I also agree with Caesar's OP.
 

Bruce B

WBF Founding Member, Pro Audio Production Member
Apr 25, 2010
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www.pugetsoundstudios.com
JTinn, that depends on whether you are in the ss camp or the tube camp. The Dart's are GREAT ss amps, no doubt; BUT they don't have the same characteristics as the CAT amps...nor do they have quite the macro and micro dynamic shadings as the CAT amps IMO. OTOH, they are probably a LOT easier to live with and maintain than tube amps.
I agree completely with Paul ( Occam), the preamp can be altered to taste, depending on the tube that is 'rolled' in. I also agree with Caesar's OP.

+1..... I got some tubes from Kevin Deal and found the CAT one of the best pre's I've ever heard!
 

DaveyF

Well-Known Member
Jul 31, 2010
6,129
181
458
La Jolla, Calif USA
+1..... I got some tubes from Kevin Deal and found the CAT one of the best pre's I've ever heard!

Bruce, I have done exactly the same thing with my CAT. Kevin Deal gave me some great recommendations and I now use NOS Mullards and NOS GE's. The sound leapt to another level- that frankly I have never heard bettered from any other preamp.
 

Bruce B

WBF Founding Member, Pro Audio Production Member
Apr 25, 2010
7,006
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1,740
Snohomish, WA
www.pugetsoundstudios.com
Bruce, I have done exactly the same thing with my CAT. Kevin Deal gave me some great recommendations and I now use NOS Mullards and NOS GE's. The sound leapt to another level- that frankly I have never heard bettered from any other preamp.

I'd put the CAT Legend up against any FF pre.
 

Peter Breuninger

[Industry Expert] Member Sponsor
Jul 20, 2010
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I bailed on CAT preamps years ago due to the course volume increments. As a reviewer I have to level match as best possible. I had three CAT preamps and loved them. I remember borrowing my first CAT, it was Keith Jarrett's trade in to Soundex Berwyn. At the time I had an Audio Research SP11 based on HP's review. The CAT smoked it. The CAT was much more detailed and transparent plus more holographic. I think HP missed the ball with the SPII. This was when I knew I had to trust my own ears and even the great HP was prone to error.
 

caesar

Well-Known Member
May 30, 2010
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Yes, everyone I talk to tells me CAT will smoke any other tube gear. I know Audio Research has a very strong, almost fanatical following, but I wonder how many folks would keep Audio Research if they tried a CAT in their system (unless they have NOLA speakers).
 

caesar

Well-Known Member
May 30, 2010
4,290
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It seems like CAT purposefully plays hard to get. My understanding is that they don't have a remote on their gear. It takes a very long time to get the gear made. They don't have many dealers to hear it. They don't submit their gear for reviews....
 

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