Tripoint troy signature grounding device

Mike Lavigne · Oct 21, 2017

Audiocrack said:
Grounding loudspeakers is a relatively unknown phenomenon in our audio world, let alone that a loudspeaker manufacturer makes grounding an integral part of his loudspeaker concept. Jorn Janczak of Tidal Audio did and went at great length to shield the xover chambers against all kind of nasty noises. Combining a state of the art grounding grounding cable - and just to put things in (the right) perspective: Miguel informed me that building his Emperor grounding cables is actually the most difficult Tripoint work he is doing and building one of these ‘Anaconda’s’ costs him three weeks - with a state of the art loudspeaker that incorporates special grounding measures was something I had never experienced before and is furthermore something that I will never forget.

In short I heard the following:
- The music reproduction became more liquid and smooth.
- The tonality became clearly more beautiful and fuller.
- More serinity/calmness.
- The noise floor dropped and as a consequence the transparency increased and I heard more inner detail.
- The focussing increased.
- The solidity became better, so there was more authority or command.

Al these as aspects resulted in an audio reproduction that I had never experienced before.

Lastly, I leave one aspect unmentioned for now because it will undoubtedly be the most controversial in the eyes of all of you, that is our WBF members. As a non technie I do not know if there is any valid technical explanation for it - although I have an idea - but I suppose this last aspect is one that belongs in the category: (only) hearing is believing.

+1.

a few weeks ago I was discovering this same issue here;

http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showt...ounding-device&p=472968&viewfull=1#post472968

it was just one of those 'what can I do now?' moments. and away I went. sometimes it is better to be a non-techie so we are not afraid to try things.

in my case, I was using the modest Tripoint Signature Silver standard ground cables, so not close to those Emperor monsters.....but the boost was clear and musically significant.....and in similar ways, if less profoundly. and in my case I had to improvise a hopefully useful place to attach the ground, as the speaker builder had not anticipated my need.

Audiocrack · Oct 21, 2017

Mike Lavigne said:
+1.

a few weeks ago I was discovering this same issue here;

http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showt...ounding-device&p=472968&viewfull=1#post472968

it was just one of those 'what can I do now?' moments. and away I went. sometimes it is better to be a non-techie so we are not afraid to try things.

in my case, I was using the modest Tripoint Signature Silver standard ground cables, so not close to those Emperor monsters.....but the boost was clear and musically significant.....and in similar ways, if less profoundly. and in my case I had to improvise a hopefully useful place to attach the ground, as the speaker builder had not anticipated my need.

Interesting and good to hear that our experiences concur in this regard, Mike.

Btw, Miguel went as far as to remark that only after grounding the Tidal LA’s the voicing of these loudspeakers became really to his liking. I disagree with him on this point but let there be no doubt about it: after grounding the LA’s and my Kondo preamp with the ‘Anaconda’s’ - that is the Tripoint Emperor grounding cables - the musical reproduction took an impressive (big) leap and became really magical.

Also noteworthing is the following: After inserting the two (newly made/Elite) Emperor mk ii powercords (unlike the Troy Signature and Troy Elite the Emperor ‘grounding box’ employs two powercords) in my two powerstrips - one powerstrip for the digital components and one powerstrip for all other audio equipment - and without grounding any component the effect of adding this ‘grounding box’ already became immediately (and in a significant way) noticeble. So for all (new) Tripoint Troy Elite owners it is imho an interesting experiment to put only the powercord of the Elite in your powerstrip and listen to what happens. After the Elite has settled somewhat you can start grounding component after component and experience more and more ‘beauty’.

audioblazer · Oct 21, 2017

These are the images of earlier model . Judge for yourself it’s worth even though I can attest to it that it’s a great ground box

Audiocrack · Oct 21, 2017

audioblazer said:
These are the images of earlier model . Judge for yourself it’s worth even though I can attest to it that it’s a great ground box
View attachment 36670
View attachment 36669

Do not know how old this model is, but apparently Miguel brought things on a alltogether different plane by now. If I remember correctly the prices of the origininal ‘grounding boxes’ were (clearly) lower than the current models while the latter sound much better than the original ones. I have seen my Emperor and Empress boxes from the inside and not only is the built quality impeccable but also the quality of all materials that are being used is impressive.

audioblazer · Oct 21, 2017

Earliest model retail for USD8k. Signature model retail for USD14k, not small change to most of us. However if there is 1 ground box I want to own , it will be Tripoints . Just that I felt that I would be better off upgrading components eg catridge

Audiocrack · Oct 21, 2017

audioblazer said:
Earliest model retail for USD8k. Signature model retail for USD14k, not small change to most of us. However if there is 1 ground box I want to own , it will be Tripoints . Just that I felt that I would be better off upgrading components eg catridge

You have got a marvelous audio system. If you could add a Tripoint Troy Elite I would not be surprised at all if you would conclude in the end: this is a superb return on (audio) investment. All the audio components that you will hook up to the Elite will sound (much) better than ever before.

Btw, the picture you posted is of a Troy mk 1 that is 8 years old.

audioblazer · Oct 21, 2017

I have no doubt Elite will be great for my syst . From my experiment with Entreq , Telos & 8 yrs old Tripoints , Tripoints is the only ground box that did wonders to my syst bass performance.
If I m not mistaken , the current version consist of 3 barrels of minerals & copper rod at the centre of the barrel instead of 2. Entreq looks so dirt cheap on the inside

Audiocrack · Oct 21, 2017

Actually Miguel showed me pictures of the inside of the Entreq boxes and in all honesty I was shocked. Apparently the Entreq boxes do something because otherwise they would not be so popular under the WBF members, but I am glad that I never invested any money in them. From a built quality point of view Entreq cannot be compared to Tripoint (and yes I realize that Entreq is cheaper than Tripoint).

And the Tripoint technique is much more sophisticated than you just described.

Mike Lavigne · Oct 21, 2017

Audiocrack said:
Interesting and good to hear that our experiences concur in this regard, Mike.

Btw, Miguel went as far as to remark that only after grounding the Tidal LA’s the voicing of these loudspeakers became really to his liking. I disagree with him on this point but let there be no doubt about it: after grounding the LA’s and my Kondo preamp with the ‘Anaconda’s’ - that is the Tripoint Emperor grounding cables - the musical reproduction took an impressive (big) leap and became really magical.

Also noteworthing is the following: After inserting the two (newly made/Elite) Emperor mk ii powercords (unlike the Troy Signature and Troy Elite the Emperor ‘grounding box’ employs two powercords) in my two powerstrips - one powerstrip (Oyaide R-1) for the digital components and one powerstrip for all other audio equipment - and without grounding any component the effect of adding this ‘grounding box’ already became immediately (and in a significant way) noticeble. So for all (new) Tripoint Troy Elite owners it is imho an interesting experiment to put only the powercord of the Elite in your powerstrip and listen to what happens. After the Elite has settled somewhat you can start grounding component after component and experience more and more ‘beauty’.

interesting about just the Elite and Troy Sig power cords 'only' as a step, I will have to try that. Miguel has encouraged me to experiment with the power cord placement of the Elite on the sources, but I've not yet got around to that. i'm so much enjoying how things are i'm having a hard time wanting to disrupt it for more experimenting. likely one day i'll just do it. I have a power strip (Oyaide R-1) for my non signal path gear; but right now all my active gear is into wall outlets into the Equi=tech. which does distribute them around since, for example, there are three digital power cords; one for each power supply of my MSB, and one for the SGM server.

is your power strip a commercial product? or a one-off custom one? I have thought of this new power strip and move all my digital to it. I can't get enough of the NCF material into my power grid. I saw it at RMAF and was impressed. but it's not cheap.

for the Troy Sig on the amps, I did have the power cord on the right amp duplex outlet (each mono block has it's own 20amp dedicated outlet, there are 5 across that 'amp' wall...and one is unused in the middle); and I switched to the middle unused outlet; Miguel thought that might balance things out better and help with sound staging. no conclusions yet on that change.

Mike Lavigne · Oct 21, 2017

audioblazer said:
Just that I felt that I would be better off upgrading components eg catridge

which is always the rub. it seems everyone wants me to have more carts, arms and tt's.....which no doubt is the fun stuff to compare as many can play. and btw; I agree that it is fun.

for me; I've always been a 'system first' guy. a high tide raises all ships. #1-room, #2-speakers-amps, #3--system synergy, #4--signal path and power grid optimization. but how much whole system focus is enough, and when do you buy more 'toys'? and if you are trying to have the best of every format, then adding 'toys' gets more challenging.

we all have our own perspectives. there is no one way. no doubt adding top level Tripoint can require a significant portion of the whole picture of asset distribution. i'm pretty happy with the contribution the Tripoint makes to the musical equation for all my sources. I cannot see how else it could be accomplished. having more source choices (particularly carts and arms) for me myself is less important, but I will get around to it at some point.

853guy · Oct 21, 2017

Mike Lavigne said:
is your power strip a commercial product? or a one-off custom one. I have thought of this new power strip and move all my digital to it. I can't get enough of the NCF material into my power grid. I saw it at RMAF and was impressed. but it's not cheap.

Hi Mike,

The Acoustic Revive RPT-6 Absolute NCF has also been updated with Nano Crystal Formula outlets and inlet:

http://www.lotusgroupusa.com/rtp-series-power-conditioners.html

Jeff Day reviewed it here:

http://positive-feedback.com/audio-discourse/the-acoustic-revive-chronicles/

Pardon the detour - back to all things Tripoint.

Best,

853guy

Mike Lavigne · Oct 21, 2017

853guy said:
Hi Mike,

The Acoustic Revive RPT-6 Absolute NCF has also been updated with Nano Crystal Formula outlets and inlet:

http://www.lotusgroupusa.com/rtp-series-power-conditioners.html

Jeff Day reviewed it here:

http://positive-feedback.com/audio-discourse/the-acoustic-revive-chronicles/

Pardon the detour - back to all things Tripoint.

Best,

853guy

thank you 853guy. good to have that choice right there for folks. I will check it out.

853guy · Oct 21, 2017

Mike Lavigne said:
thank you 853guy. good to have that choice right there for folks. I will check it out.

Cheers, Mike!

I have it on a short list myself, but would of course love to hear your thoughts should you get to hear it.

853guy

Audiocrack · Oct 21, 2017

Mike Lavigne said:
interesting about just the Elite and Troy Sig power cords 'only' as a step, I will have to try that. Miguel has encouraged me to experiment with the power cord placement of the Elite on the sources, but I've not yet got around to that. i'm so much enjoying how things are i'm having a hard time wanting to disrupt it for more experimenting. likely one day i'll just do it. I have a power strip (Oyaide R-1) for my non signal path gear; but right now all my active gear is into wall outlets into the Equi=tech. which does distribute them around since, for example, there are three digital power cords; one for each power supply of my MSB, and one for the SGM server.

is your power strip a commercial product? or a one-off custom one? I have thought of this new power strip and move all my digital to it. I can't get enough of the NCF material into my power grid. I saw it at RMAF and was impressed. but it's not cheap.

View attachment 36673

for the Troy Sig on the amps, I did have the power cord on the right amp duplex outlet (each mono block has it's own 20amp dedicated outlet, there are 5 across that 'amp' wall...and one is unused in the middle); and I switched to the middle unused outlet; Miguel thought that might balance things out better and help with sound staging. no conclusions yet on that change.

My powerstrips are made in Germany. They have a dedicated grounding post to them and were refurbished (inter alia better wire) by Rene of Audio Refine. I did not compare various strips but according to Rene my strips are as good as the top of the HB Cable Design strips that are (way) more costly. Before I made this move I had been seriously thinking about the HB Star Galaxy Powerslave.

Audiocrack · Oct 21, 2017

My (listening) room has (pretty) good but not great acoustics. It is 4,5m wide, 3,5m high and about 12-14m long (depending on whether or not you take the conservatory into account). The front and back room (we call it in Europe an ‘en suite’ room) are separated by two sliding doors. Why am I mentioning all this?

Well, there is this one last aspect of adding the Anaconda’s - the three Tripoint Emperor grounding cables - to my Tidal LA system that I did not mention in any of my previous posts: larger soundstaging and less room interference. I clearly experienced not only more solidity/command in the musical presentation as well as all other positive musical aspects I listed before, but also a deeper and wider soundstage in such a degree that the side and back walls of my (listening) room seemed to disappear more than ever before. As a consequence the room seemed to interfere less with the musical presentation than ever before and the latter became so much more pure and ‘real’.

I fully understand if you people are sceptical about this last aspect - I called it in one of my earlier post controversial - and as a non-technie I do not know if there is any valid technical explanation for this listening experience. However, I - as well as the people that visited me during Miguel’s stay - experienced a wall of sound that was (definately) less restricted by the room acoustics. I suppose this is what we might call a ‘hearing=believing’ experience.

Might this exciting and (for me anyway) new experience have something to do with ‘fixing’ or reducing phase and timing issues? I am not sure about this so maybe you can tell me, but I can assure you it was one of the most fascinating (musical replay) experiences of my (audio) life.

Mike Lavigne · Oct 21, 2017

Audiocrack said:
My powerstrips are made in Germany. They have a dedicated grounding post to them and were refurbished (inter alia better wire) by Rene of Audio Refine. I did not compare various strips but according to Rene my strips are as good as the top of the HB Cable Design strips that are (way) more costly. Before I made this move I had been seriously thinking about the HB Star Galaxy Powerslave.

thank you Rudolf.

I think i'm leaning to get the Furutech e-TP809 NCF for my digital since it is consistent with my other power cord plugs and outlets. I think for power grid it is important to have one approach for transparent sound.

Audiocrack · Oct 21, 2017

Mike Lavigne said:
thank you Rudolf.

I think i'm leaning to get the Furutech e-TP809 NCF for my digital since it is consistent with my other power cord plugs and outlets. I think for power grid it is important to have one approach for transparent sound.

You are most welcome, Mike. I am not familiar with the Furutech strip you just mentioned.

Mike Lavigne · Oct 21, 2017

Audiocrack said:
My (listening) room has (pretty) good but not great acoustics. It is 4,5m wide, 3,5m high and about 12-14m long (depending on whether or not you take the conservatory into account). The front and back room (we call it in Europe an ‘en suite’ room) are separated by two sliding doors. Why am I mentioning all this?

Well, there is this one last aspect of adding the Anaconda’s - the three Tripoint Emperor grounding cables - to my Tidal LA system that I did not mention in any of my previous posts: larger soundstaging and less room interference. I clearly experienced not only more solidity/command in the musical presentation as well as all other positive musical aspects I listed before, but also a deeper and wider soundstage in such a degree that the side and back walls of my (listening) room seemed to disappear more than ever before. As a consequence the room seemed to interfere less with the musical presentation than ever before and the latter became so much more pure and ‘real’.

I fully understand if you people are sceptical about this last aspect - I called it in one of my earlier post controversial - and as a non-technie I do not know if there is any valid technical explanation for this listening experience. However, I - as well as the people that visited me during Miguel’s stay - experienced a wall of sound that was (definately) less restricted by the room acoustics. I suppose this is what we might call a ‘hearing=believing’ experience.

Might this exciting and (for me anyway) new experience have something to do with ‘fixing’ or reducing phase and timing issues? I am not sure about this so maybe you can tell me, but I can assure you it was one of the most fascinating (musical replay) experiences of my (audio) life.

even in my room which is absolutely purpose built and ultra tweaked for optimal acoustics already, all the moves lately with Tripoint products (added Thor SE, moving Troy Sig to amps, added Elite, and grounding main towers) have certainly yielded clear solid steps forward with sound staging. and that last step of grounding my passive towers was no different. overall the effect is of an added dimensionality to the sound, along with more complete decays, micro dynamic energy, and textures which transcend the physical boundaries of my room. and with the greater impact of these 'Anaconda' prototype Emperor cables in your situation I could easily understand some dramatic differences in room integration over your previous situation.

why it happens I will leave for others to debate.....I don't even care.

only that you have no convincing to do with me; it is exactly what I would expect to happen. I know how precious your room culture is to you and I don't blame you considering the special place you enjoy, so if these new cables can bring your closer to ideal acoustics without the aesthetic compromises then i'm happy for you. it has to help to justify the investment as you get to have your cake and eat it too.

Mike Lavigne · Oct 21, 2017

Audiocrack said:
You are most welcome, Mike. I am not familiar with the Furutech strip you just mentioned.

I linked it above; it is a new product using the NCF technology. here is the link again;

http://www.furutech.com/2017/09/29/15579/

I use the same technology power grid duplex outlets, and the same plugs on all my power cords......as used in this power strip.

Audiocrack · Oct 21, 2017

Mike Lavigne said:
even in my room which is absolutely purpose built and ultra tweaked for optimal acoustics already, all the moves lately with Tripoint products (added Thor SE, moving Troy Sig to amps, added Elite, and grounding main towers) have certainly yielded clear solid steps forward with sound staging. and that last step of grounding my passive towers was no different. overall the effect is of an added dimensionality to the sound, along with more complete decays, micro dynamic energy, and textures which transcend the physical boundaries of my room. and with the greater impact of these 'Anaconda' prototype Emperor cables in your situation I could easily understand some dramatic differences in room integration over your previous situation.

why it happens I will leave for others to debate.....I don't even care.

only that you have no convincing to do with me; it is exactly what I would expect to happen. I know how precious your room culture is to you and I don't blame you considering the special place you enjoy, so if these new cables can bring your closer to ideal acoustics without the aesthetic compromises then i'm happy for you. it has to help to justify the investment as you get to have your cake and eat it too.

Thanks again for your kind words, Mike.

Is it not (very) intriguing that even in your - in comparison to my listening space much larger and dedicated - listening room with top notch acoustics inserting the various Tripoint components you just listed added dimensionality to the sound and textures which transcend the physical boundaries of your room? In my - in various ways more restricted - listening environment I found this phenomenon and the extent of it absolutely amazing and fascinating!

Tripoint troy signature grounding device

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