Brass screws for speaker drivers?

es347

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Rick Schultz....blah blah blah...zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
 

mep

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What he fails to mention is that many speakers simply screw metal fasteners into wood/MDF and once you remove a screw and reuse the same screw hole, you will probably never be able to tighten that screw as well as it was tightened the first time. When I had to replace a woofer on my Martin Logan Aerius speakers, the instructions that came with the woofer said to not use the original holes and drill new ones.
 

NorthStar

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I wonder; how many people drill new holes in their speaker's front baffle when replacing a new driver?
...I know I never did myself, only for newer spikes under the bottom plinth, to accommodate their newer size.

* The screws I use are the same that came with the speakers.
And if I was going to change them; they would be 24k pure gold, or copper as my second choice.

Brass? ...Good for tubas, trumpets, trombones, etc. ...Or is silver better? :b
 

garylkoh

WBF Technical Expert (Speakers & Audio Equipment)
Sep 6, 2010
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How would a screw resonate by being damped along almost its entire length when screwed into mdf or wood? What I found much more important was the amount of torque put on the screw (neither too little nor too much and this torque is dependent on the driver the screw secures), and the actual design of the screw. Wood screws are bad going into mdf because the material behaves completely differently. Sheet metal screws are a decent alternative. I ended up designing my own screws...... in steel.
 

garylkoh

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You design your own screws Gary! ...Any pics?

Don't have any pictures on my computer.

I wanted a hex drive (or allen-drive) because that mates to a powered screwdriver much better with less risk of slippage than either phillips or flat screwdrivers to ensure the proper torque. A standard wood screw has too large a shaft in relation to the thread depth. A sheet metal screw has the correct shaft/thread relationship but thread pitch is too steep for mdf, so I ended up designing my own when I couldn't find any to buy.......

Necessity is the mother of invention - Plato.
 

Phelonious Ponk

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I think I've lost my will to live....

I just reset the angle on the neck of an electric guitar I just purchased. It's what they call a bolt-on neck, actually a steel plate and four big wood screws. I didn't use a torque driver. I don't know a professional luthier (guitar builder/repair person) who does, actually. You hand tighten them, until they will tighten no more, and it's advisable not to use a screw driver with too big a handle (like that torque driver) because you don't want to strip out the holes. Of course if you do, a couple of hardwood toothpicks and some carpenters' glue does the trick.

Sloppy bastards, those of us who just make the music.

Of course what this video misses completely is which is better, transferring the energy from the driver through the frame, and the screws, to the cabinet, or keeping that energy in the speaker, isolating it from the cabinet. That wouldn't be brass, that would bigger holes, treaded steel sleeves and machine screws. And of course isolation vs, transfer depends on the design of the speaker (maybe) and if you go and change the material of the screws and the torque of them, aren't you buggering around with the design?

Probably not, actually. You're probably just changing the screws; this tool is probably just selling you a tool, and then you're talking yourself into hearing a more balanced, solid sound stage. See Amir's post on "placebo."

Tim
 

NorthStar

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Ok, this is off-topic. ...I have an acoustic 6-string Norman guitar (Manic model) for the studio (maple; real light and very fragile). ...Among others (acoustic 12-string, electric, and classical.)

The guitar's neck is adjustable by one screw (allen key) on the inside at the base of the neck.
So you can straighten the neck when the wood is working; too hot or too cold. ...Demands precision and experience.
And also the neck is fully removable (two screws behind the caisson).

I know few luthiers, and inside my guitar is the blood of one (a very good one, who lives north of Vernon, in the Okanagan Valley, of British Columbia, deep in one of the mountain's forests), after he cut himself in repairing my guitar with a wood patch inside. ....His blood is there for life (DNA). ...Too long of a story; for another time in a dedicated Musical Instruments' thread. :b

The removable neck uses two metal screws (most likely steel, white/grey), and which are covered by two chrome plated cap heads.
And the adjustable neck uses what I believe to be a tungsten (steel) screw (black anodized), but I'm not certain hundred percent.

- Screws are a good subject in audio, and music. :b
 
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Phelonious Ponk

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Ok, this is off-topic. ...I have an acoustic 6-string Norman guitar (Manic model) for the studio (maple; real light and very fragile). ...Among others (acoustic 12-string, electric, and classical.)

The guitar's neck is adjustable by one screw (allen key) on the inside at the base of the neck.
So you can straighten the neck when the wood is working; too hot or too cold. ...Demands precision and experience.
And also the neck is fully removable (two screws behind the caisson).

I know few luthiers, and inside my guitar is the blood of one (a very good one, who lives north of Vernon, in the Okanagan Valley, of British Columbia, deep in one of the mountain's forests), after he cut himself in repairing my guitar with a wood patch inside. ....His blood is there for life (DNA). ...Too long of a story; for another time in a dedicated Musical Instruments' thread. :b

The removable neck uses two metal screws, which appear to have chrome plated (colored only) heads.
And the adjustable neck uses what I believe to be a tungsten (steel) screw (black anodized), but I'm not certain hundred percent.

- Screws are a good subject in audio, and music. :b

That one screw on the inside of the base of the neck, in all likelihood, adjust the "relief" of the neck. A term that refers to a slight concave curve that the truss rod puts in the neck between the head (the nut, actually) end and the point at which the neck joins the body. It gives the strings room to vibrate without buzzing against the frets. Guidelines for how to adjust relief can be found all over the net.

And now we're WAY off topic...

Tim
 

NorthStar

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That one screw on the inside of the base of the neck, in all likelihood, adjust the "relief" of the neck. A term that refers to a slight concave curve that the truss rod puts in the neck between the head (the nut, actually) end and the point at which the neck joins the body. It gives the strings room to vibrate without buzzing against the frets. Guidelines for how to adjust relief can be found all over the net.

And now we're WAY off topic...

Tim

Yes, that is exactly it Tim. ...It's a rod to straighten your neck so that the strings don't buzz of hitting the frets too prematurely due to a curved neck. ...Ebony templates, and all that 'coquillage' repair points. ... *The curve could be convex or concave.

Still though, that rod acts like a giant tuning screw. And! ...Perhaps it also vibrates inside the neck.
 

Phelonious Ponk

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Yes, that is exactly it Tim. ...It's a rod to straighten your neck so that the strings don't buzz of hitting the frets too prematurely due to a curved neck. ...Ebony templates, and all that 'coquillage' repair points. ... *The curve could be convex or concave.

Still though, that rod acts like a giant tuning screw. And! ...Perhaps it also vibrates inside the neck.

Actually it's a rod to straighten or, more often than not, curve your neck just a bit forward. A dead straight neck is a good thing if the neck/body geometry is perfect...but it rarely is. I love doing my own set-up. Probably the closest I'll come to setting up a turntable. :)

Tim
 

NorthStar

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I use my own tuning (own chords), and I use strings made of brass, or silver, or even copper, and nylon for my classical one;
I just don't like 'standard' tuning. ...For anything! :D ...Same with screws; I apply my own preferred torque (drivers in loudspeakers, audio components, musical instruments, but not cars, trucks, motorcycles, and boats).

- WireWorld; who runs it?
 

NorthStar

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One last thing here: If that video from the first post was truly of any importance, why is that that I don't know any speaker's manufacturers supplying an instruction manual indicating the torque force of the screws from the drivers (woofer, midrange, and tweeter)? ...And also which proper tool you need to apply the correct force.

And! ...Why is that that 99.99%+ of all speakers don't use brass screws? ...And how truly important the metal (steel) screw has on the magnet of the driver?

And! How come I am reading this only this month of July of the year 2013?

And! Who is that guy again? ...From the video.

* Which speaker's manufacturer abide by those laws?
 

GaryProtein

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Jul 25, 2012
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As most machinists know, the optimal torque and pre-load for a screw is 1/4 turn before it strips.
 

Phelonious Ponk

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Correct. Don't know why so many people can't figure that out. :)

Tim
 

GaryProtein

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If I thought brass would make any difference, I would replace all 864 screws holding my drivers into their supports, but I don't.

Would bronze be better than brass? Would grade 1, 2, 3, or 4 pure titanium or grade 5 or other titanium alloy be better than brass??????? HA! I'm just joking, I still wouldn't change the screws.
 
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GaryProtein

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It is easy to strip the heads of brass screws because it is such a soft metal. So unless they have real value, you don't want to use them in manufacturing.

Ahhhh, the value of the TORX driver!

Still, I think it would be hard to strip a Phillips head brass screw going into wood unless you were a really clumsy mechanic.
 

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