Major Bob Carver Announcement: now selling direct (Emotiva)

Andre Marc · Jun 18, 2013

Bob Carver Vacuum Tube Company has officially been acquired by Jade Design (Emotiva).

They are now selling some products direct.

The Black Magic VTA120 20 wpc (40 wpc in mono block configuration) EL84M amp I reviewed for Tone Audio Issue 53
is now.....$1690. It used to be $2400 through dealers and Music Direct.

Folks, in my humble opinion, this is the steal of the decade. This combined with the Kef LS50
would be a ridiculous combo for around $3000.

http://www.bobcarver.com/vta20s.asp

NorthStar · Jun 19, 2013

Thanks Andre for sharing!

And true; seems to be a good match for the KEF LS50 Anniversary Model monitors. ...With a NAD Music Server as the source? ...Or a TT?

JackD201 · Jun 19, 2013

I always liked el84s, fun and punchy little things. I'd love to see a shootout between this and Manley's Stingray.

taters · Jun 19, 2013

Andre Marc said:
Bob Carver Vacuum Tube Company has officially been acquired by Jade Design (Emotiva).

They are now selling some products direct.

The Black Magic VTA120 20 wpc (40 wpc in mono block configuration) EL84M amp I reviewed for Tone Audio Issue 53
is now.....$1690. It used to be $2400 through dealers and Music Direct.

Folks, in my humble opinion, this is the steal of the decade. This combined with the Kef LS50
would be a ridiculous combo for around $3000.

http://www.bobcarver.com/vta20s.asp

Music Direct spent a lot of money advertising Bob carver products in their catalog. I'm sure they can't be to happy about this.

MylesBAstor · Jun 19, 2013

A lot of companies have analyzed and assessed the pros and cons of going direct. If selling direct was so advantageous, then why aren't more than a handful doing that nowadays? The real problem that most manufacturers face is not the sales but dealing with finicky (to be kind) audiophiles who will then drive them crazy and in the end return the product. Then what does the manufacturers do? They have to sell the unit at a loss because the equipment can no longer be sold as new. Enough of these and it's like a hospital accepting medicaid. Goodbye.

taters · Jun 19, 2013

MylesBAstor said:
A lot of companies have analyzed and assessed the pros and cons of going direct. If selling direct was so advantageous, then why aren't more than a handful doing that nowadays? The real problem that most manufacturers face is not the sales but dealing with finicky (to be kind) audiophiles who will then drive them crazy and in the end return the product. Then what does the manufacturers do? They have to sell the unit at a loss because the equipment can no longer be sold as new. Enough of these and it's like a hospital accepting medicaid. Goodbye.

I think you will see more companies going direct in the next couple of years. Cary audio will sell you direct now if you don't have a dealer within 100 miles from where you live. Actually it's better for the consumer in the long run. They can save a lot of money.

MylesBAstor · Jun 19, 2013

taters said:
I think you will see more companies going direct in the next couple of years. Cary audio will sell you direct now if you don't have a dealer within 100 miles from where you live. Actually it's better for the consumer in the long run. They can save a lot of money.

I've been hearing that for years. Actions speak louder than words.

Basically the only companies selling direct are some new companies that so far are closed out of high-end stores.

If I was Cary, I'd give the business to one of my nearest stores. But is Cary selling it for the same retail price as the store charges? If so, isn't Cary then making more money since they collect both their own mark up and the store's?

es347 · Jun 19, 2013

Where are they mfd?

Andre Marc · Jun 19, 2013

NorthStar said:
Thanks Andre for sharing!

And true; seems to be a good match for the KEF LS50 Anniversary Model monitors. ...With a NAD Music Server as the source? ...Or a TT?

My pleasure Bob. I have not experience with the NAD. Maybe the best source hear would be the Oppo 105!

Andre Marc · Jun 19, 2013

MylesBAstor said:
A lot of companies have analyzed and assessed the pros and cons of going direct. If selling direct was so advantageous, then why aren't more than a handful doing that nowadays? The real problem that most manufacturers face is not the sales but dealing with finicky (to be kind) audiophiles who will then drive them crazy and in the end return the product. Then what does the manufacturers do? They have to sell the unit at a loss because the equipment can no longer be sold as new. Enough of these and it's like a hospital accepting medicaid. Goodbye.

Clearly, Emotiva decided to apply their business model after the acquisition.

I agree there are pitfalls to going direct.

Andre Marc · Jun 19, 2013

es347 said:
Where are they mfd?

USA. I believe Emotiva is moving Carver operations to TN.

Andre Marc · Jun 19, 2013

JackD201 said:
I always liked el84s, fun and punchy little things. I'd love to see a shootout between this and Manley's Stingray.

Stingray is a great amp. As a matter of fact, all Manley gear is really good. I do feel that the Carver is quieter.

taters · Jun 19, 2013

Andre Marc said:
USA. I believe Emotiva is moving Carver operations to TN.

Bob Carver is already in Tennessee.

Andre Marc · Jun 19, 2013

taters said:
Bob Carver is already in Tennessee.

I could be wrong, but he is based in KY. The website lists Franklin, TN as the HQ, which is Emotiva.

taters · Jun 19, 2013

Andre Marc said:
I could be wrong, but he is based in KY. The website lists Franklin, TN as the HQ, which is Emotiva.

I guess I'm wrong because I thought he was in Tennessee.

puroagave · Jun 19, 2013

Andre Marc said:
Folks, in my humble opinion, this is the steal of the decade. This combined with the Kef LS50
would be a ridiculous combo for around $3000.

imo, in a normal sized room you need more than 20wpc to drive an 85db sensitive speaker. you'll clip the amp on 98 db peaks.

NorthStar · Jun 19, 2013

puroagave said:
imo, in a normal sized room you need more than 20wpc to drive an 85db sensitive speaker. you'll clip the amp on 98 db peaks.

Lesse: "The LS50 has roughly an average sensitivity of 84.5dB, and drops to 4 ohms at 200Hz and to 5.4 ohms at the top of the audio band.
The combination of the electrical phase of -41 degree at 135Hz and an impedance of 5.3 ohms at that frequency highly suggests that a 4 ohm amplifier is best for the LS50 monitors."

=> http://www.stereophile.com/content/kef-ls50-anniversary-model-loudspeaker-measurements

Rob, you have a valid point. ...The Black Magic VTA20S ($1,700 and still expensive for some) is a 20 wpc amp (into 8 ohms).

NorthStar · Jun 19, 2013

Emotiva wants to have their products made more and more in the ol' USA; from what I've just read over at the Lounge. ...Same for whiskey.

...The Bob Carver tubed amps (and Subs eventually) definitely made in the USA. I think.

KeithR · Jun 19, 2013

MylesBAstor said:
A lot of companies have analyzed and assessed the pros and cons of going direct. If selling direct was so advantageous, then why aren't more than a handful doing that nowadays? The real problem that most manufacturers face is not the sales but dealing with finicky (to be kind) audiophiles who will then drive them crazy and in the end return the product. Then what does the manufacturers do? They have to sell the unit at a loss because the equipment can no longer be sold as new. Enough of these and it's like a hospital accepting medicaid. Goodbye.

Zu Audio has been around over a decade now, direct.
Daedulus seems to be doing decent
Odyssey (an Alon Wolf fav) has been doing it since the late 90s
Modwright isn't going anywhere
Red Wine Audio has done well

I think for more value-oriented companies (like Carver actually) it can make some sense. I don't think selling Magico or Wilson direct is reasonable. Old world companies like ARC, CJ, etc have 40 years of brand recognition, so it's a very different decision.

I think a lot of folks just go through distributors directly on the foreign made stuff. And some dealers now are becoming distributors (Upscale w/ Primaluna) as the model has changed.

The old school dealer model to me is broken now. I was just asked to pay $250 to demo a used piece of gear at a local dealer- and he's a dealer for the line. GTFO.

KeithR · Jun 19, 2013

Well, the obvious response to the OP is that Carver gear isn't selling well in stores. He's not doing this by choice is my guess.

btw, Tesla is trying to do the same in the car world and is seeing big resistance by the dealer network in several states.

Major Bob Carver Announcement: now selling direct (Emotiva)

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