Upsampled SACD's

Bruce B

WBF Founding Member, Pro Audio Production Member
Apr 25, 2010
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Thanks Bruce,
but if they are from the same PCM source and both formats are mastered so are not clipping 0dbfs (or -3dbfs), from your experience do they adjust the SACD master to be louder/quieter or make it the same as redbook?Orb

In my experience the SACD has always been quieter to take advantage of the increased headroom over Redbook. That's one reason why people prefer the DSD file because it's more dynamic.
 

garylkoh

WBF Technical Expert (Speakers & Audio Equipment)
Sep 6, 2010
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www.genesisloudspeakers.com
In my experience the SACD has always been quieter to take advantage of the increased headroom over Redbook. That's one reason why people prefer the DSD file because it's more dynamic.

Seems to be like what Reference Recordings did with their high-rez HRx releases. The level is quieter, so you play it louder, and when the dynamics kick in it's exhilarating. That's what dynamic range is all about :D
 

Orb

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Sep 8, 2010
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In my experience the SACD has always been quieter to take advantage of the increased headroom over Redbook. That's one reason why people prefer the DSD file because it's more dynamic.

Thanks Bruce,
I am just wondering if and what the differences are between the CD and SACD in the context of your earlier post - not trying to catch you out (hope it is not coming across like that) but curious if they adjusted the loudness while technically the dynamics were same, as per the article in a recent magazine on a very few gold CDs vs normal CD version - although they did also confirm for whatever reason mech reads were 50% improved in terms of servo-read errors, but it was I think about 1.5 to 2db louder as well so again affecting perception.
No, the problem is that labels record at 44.1 or 48k and then upsample to DSD for SACD. Then they give me the SACD to rip the DSD files off of them to give to HDtracks. If there is a brickwall filter at 22 or 24k, then HDtracks can not sell them as hi-rez files. People listen with their eyes (spectral analysis) and start bitchin'. I'd say, on the whole... we get 30-40% regection rate because labels repackaged lo-rez files and charged more money to dupe the consumer thinking you have hi-rez files.

I appreciate this does not reflect what you actually work on to be sold as HDtrack, but interesting for those who may consider CD vs SACD disc and whether it originates from a 16bit 44.1khz PCM, and what the differences in the remastering is.

Thanks
Orb
 

Lee

Well-Known Member
Feb 3, 2011
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In my experience the SACD has always been quieter to take advantage of the increased headroom over Redbook. That's one reason why people prefer the DSD file because it's more dynamic.

This really matches some experience I have in listening.
 

Orb

New Member
Sep 8, 2010
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The issue of HifiNews that just came out a few days ago has interesting articles on the upsampled hirez files and as Bruce mentions quite a lot that are not technically hirez and also it seems have low level noise issues due to how they were upsampled , with analysis and contacting some of the sellers such as HDtracks.
I think Keith Howard may had used his freeware utility that is available for anyone to check wav files (only does these I think as have not had a chance to test it myself).
The freeware comes in 3 parts-applications and is under Joint Time Frequency Analysis.
http://www.audiosignal.co.uk/freeware.html
Anyway if you do not own anything its cheaper than using Soundforge/Wavelab/etc :)

Anyway it seems other companies have been caught out by being sent non-hirez material but told it is; one is Linn's own hirez recording company who also sell for some other labels, this resulted in these other label's albums being removed while also now implementing a checking process, sounds pretty similar to Bruce's experience :)

Cheers
Orb
 

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