Alright, where are we? Sounds like Amir thinks we are done investigating the Furtech and we have moved on to discovering the secrets of how vinyl works.
I think that but not for the reason you are thinking. I am saying that the *data* that we are examining appears to be pointing to inconsistencies in LP playback. So to the extent we keep doing that, we are looking at LP as a medium, not the demag process.
Before we move on, were conclusions drawn as to whether or not the Furtech had an effect or are we stuck with the possibility that any changes that were seen and heard could have been caused by random changes in the vinyl interface from one play to the next?
As Spock would say, "the data as yet does not support any conclusions."
To get there, we must first determine if our testing and measurement system is working. If play to play is too variable, then all bets are off -- both for measurement sake and accepting people's observations.
I heard one version being slightly harsher and shallower. Putting aside the possibility of placebo on my behalf when examining these files, such differences in my opinion match and exceed differences by such tweaks. I have for example tested interconnect cables blindly and find them to make nearly the same difference here. When the variations in playback and/or testing is that small, the you can't count on the effect of changing any variable.
One message I’m getting from this thread is that those who already didn’t like LPs are having a field day with these little experiments. Amir for one has amused himself to no small degree.
You get those messages because you keep reading an agenda into every post. As long as you have those colored glasses on, you won't benefit from our discussion. I for one, am fascinated but not the way you think. I am fascinated at how much work and energy members are putting into gathering data and helping dissect them. Being a person who engages in these conversations to learn and discuss the technology as opposed to the person, that is fun and interesting to me.
If you put down the colored glasses for a second, you will notice that if I had an agenda to beat down this device or win one side of this argument, I would not have a) volunteered to run these tests and b) confessed of hearing a difference. There is plenty of ammunition to go after me with said results when I was the one who produced them. I am not worried about that since the nature of my involvement here is the search for information. And on that front, there is no smoking gun to use on me
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So please join me in having a good discussion and not worry about the individuals. What I think or don't think isn't going to amount to anything. But us collectively investigating the data, will give us new insights that might form our opinions and create wisdom. I know that is what it does for me.
Everyone knows that the LP medium is not perfect and nor did it ever pretend to be. I think the flaws have been well documented for many years and yet in spite of its flaws, it still sounds incredible except to those that can’t forgive an occasional pop or tick.
CDs came into the audio world proclaiming they were perfect. And Amir is on record on the forum as saying that he went to an audio store convinced that the sound of his CDs were going to trounce the sound of LPs and Amir was humbled to find out it wasn’t so. So I would ask, what’s really changed since then to make CDs any better? The only thing I can point to is that D/A converters have improved from the original wretched ones. After all, it’s hard to improve upon perfection.
I personally have no data that says CD has improved enough to beat LP. Nothing would surprise me to go and hear an LP beat the CD because of that. I heard taps at CES that were mind boggling good. So that also keeps me from saying things that I cannot back up with data or my own ears.
As I have said though, I don't like LPs regardless of whether they are better than a CD. As a technologist, it has always been my job to advance the science and engineering so that the user is ultimately in charge of it, not the other way around. The iPod did that. It put the user in charge of what to hear and when to hear it. I wont' put up with pops and glitches. I won't put up with lack of convenience. That last bit of fidelity if it exists, is not enough to get me to give these other things. And I will keep working at digital to make it as good if not better than LP. If I don't do that, I can't keep the title of engineer
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And now we are faced with the reality that CDs are disappearing from the commercial market place and soon they will only be available on-line until they go extinct all together. Soon digital will cease to exist as a physical medium and most people won’t miss it anyway. “Jewel” boxes that came pre-cracked and broken, liner notes whose small fonts were unreadable and crappy artwork to boot.
I am not sure why anyone would be surprised that after *40 year* CD's life may be coming to an end. I am worried that there are not enough of us to merit a mass market for high fidelity download service for general music. That threat is serious and merits attention from audiophiles far more than the topics we are discussing!
Ok, let’s get back to discovering the flaws of the LP medium and see what else can be unearthed to show why all those that love the medium are dunderheads.
I used to have a boss where when I would write anything for him or to send out, he would always, always first edit the English. I would keep asking him, "but what about what I said?" He would ignore that comment and keep editing it. I can't tell you how much that bothered me. It seemed like he kept criticizing me.
So one day I asked him why he did that. He said his mother was an English teacher and would never let him get away with writing anything that was less than perfect. From that moment on, it never bothered me that we was critiquing my English. I realized that was his style. And that ultimately, what he was doing was good for me anyway in improving my writing.
By the same token, I hope you stop letting our posts bother you the way they seem to be. Think that this kind of investigation and discussion will make you stronger the next time you run into someone like us. And that, it is all about the topic, and never about the person. I don't get a medal if you gave up your LP tomorrow. I do get a virtual one though if you said, "wow, I didn't know that!" As I did when I had my English corrected at times
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So let's go back to examining the data. I will go wherever that goes.
