As for the Ref3 (5 and 40) the unit(s) are quieter when the intensity of the viewing screen is turned off completely
Pricing of REF5 vs REF3
- Thread starter ulf
- Start date
Steve,
I usually keep the display of my Anniversary off because I do not like the green numbers, but it does not introduce any additional noise - I even checked with an audio spectrometer at maximum sensitivity.
Considering the REF3 my experience is different from yours as you used it unbalanced mode with your Lamm. As the noise introduced by the display in the REF3 was most probably common mode noise, when the preamplifier was used in the usual ARC balanced way this noise would cancel at the input of the amplifier. But as you said, better keeping it off!
wonder why though, motors can be off/on'd, so when it's on maybe (noise), but why when it's off? Or even if you can't fully 'off it' for some reason, seems some simple shielding would do the trick.
There used to be little external IR boxes you could buy with a motor and wheel -- could attach it to a volume knob. Anyway, I'm pretty adamant about remote volume (or IOW, getting up) so I'd struggle with that.
Maybe the noise he's talking about is from the IR receptor and circuit, not the motor moving...
It is possible nowadays to design a an IR trigger circuit that will introduce less noise in you system than the cellphone you have in your pocket ...
My opinion - and I may be wrong - is that Vladimir Lamm does not valuate the existence of the remote and as such, does not want to spend his time and effort putting a remote in his preamplifier. If he wanted to develop it he would know or could get help on how to do it properly.
It is my understanding that Spectral went through similar issues years ago and came up with some sort of sleep mode for the IR receptor... still, there's got to be a trigger somewhere and perhaps there may exist devices that are turned off completely until light excites them - sort of a special diode that allows current to go through when excited by light, but sits otherwise dormant???
I have listen to the Lamm one box pre in direct comparison with ref 3 driving VT110. Both exellent sounding but Lamm even little bit better. Sorry for the lack of remote. i will not buy a pre without a remote.
Thats an exclusive club that requires more than just the price of admission.
I have compared both the Ref 5 and the Ref5 SE. The Reference 5 SE Crushes the Reference 5. Just Saying. Unless you have heard them side by side its impossible to tell as both units are built and designed by the same company with the same signature voicing !
All, I've owned the REF3 and now the Anniversary. I've heard the REF5 and REF5SE and LS17SE in my system so I thought I would jump in here. I agree with several of the comments that I've read. The REF3 was reveletory when it came out. It sounded much better than most tube preamps of the time: quiet, great bass control, sweet midrange, open airy highs. I bought one. When the REF5 came out I felt that there was not enough improvement to warrant the price difference with trade-in. The REF 5 was a little more open on top (in my system) but $12k minus $5k trade did not make sense. My dealer agreed. Along comes the REF40. Another league entirely; much deeper well defined bass, much more open on treble, more three dimensional overall, bigger soundstage. No contest. I bought one. The REF5 SE gets closer to the Ref40 and betters the REF5. I guess if I had passed on the REF40 I probably would have upgraded the REF3 to a REF5SE. A used REF 40 at about $15K would be where I would recommend anyone looking at a REF5SE should investigate.
Final note: I've never felt that turning off the display on the REF40 made any difference in noise floor.
Final note: I've never felt that turning off the display on the REF40 made any difference in noise floor.
Arc
I agree. The Ref 5 SE Does get closer to the Ref 40 but the Ref 40 seems Blacker and more focused. Harmonic structure is a little better defined.
The New Reference 10 Preamplifier however is another ball game.
I agree. The Ref 5 SE Does get closer to the Ref 40 but the Ref 40 seems Blacker and more focused. Harmonic structure is a little better defined.
The New Reference 10 Preamplifier however is another ball game.
For what its worth, having owned the Ref 3 and 5, I thought the Ref 3 was actually, in many ways, the better sounding pre-amp. Would love to try the Ref 5 SE but alas it doesn't have the current capability to drive a low impedance load like a Spectral amp if the interconnect length is long (i.e. 25 ft). I therefore turned to the VTL preamp line (7.5 III) and have not looked back.
I also have owned both. IMHO the REF5 had more definition in the bass and a more fluid treble. The REF3 could sound more full bodied, and could be a choice in systems needing a more "tubey" signature, but it lacked the higher resolution of the REF5. In my system, I preferred the REF5 by a wide margin.
As other people said the REF40 is in a class apart.
I agree with your observations Marty. The Reference 5 actually is more Neutral which is why we get more resolution. The Reference 10 is much superior to the Reference 40 also !
One thing the Ref3 has going for it is that - as far as I know - it is the last design of Bill Johnson - and that alone makes me covet it - it will be my next upgrade
One thing the Ref3 has going for it is that - as far as I know - it is the last design of Bill Johnson - and that alone makes me covet it - it will be my next upgrade
If I took audio decisions using my heart I would still own an SP10 mk2 - but my ears prefer the REF40!
Similar threads
 | Steve Williams Site Founder | Site Owner | Administrator |  | Ron Resnick Site Co-Owner | Administrator |  | Julian (The Fixer) Website Build | Marketing Managersing |